Excadrill (Analysis)

Maybe one last nitpick, though Sand Throw should be used on pretty much every set, some sort of mention about Sand Strength and Mold Breaker should be included (for Mold Breaker, just because it's there). I won't argue how they can be useful (I would use Sand Strength in only a couple of instances). The mention could even be how they shouldn't be used over Sand Throw.
 
You should really mention that Golurk has fantastic coverage with Excadrill. Golurk is immune to fighting pokemon that usually smack Doryuuzu around and in doubles and triples he does great with No-Gaurd, making Rock slide 100% accurate. Doryuuzu also resists dark types that do respectable damage do Golurk so it makes great coverage.
 

AccidentalGreed

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We're only assuming analyses for released Dream World Pokemon and single battles. Dream World Golurk has not been released yet.
 
There seems to be the lack of what is, in my opinion...the best set up for dory, although I suppose it is because it does NOT abuse sand throw.

Rather it goes with its second (yet equally amazing) ability.

Choice scarf dory +mold breaker=amazing. It is the PERFECT counter to sand throw dory, as it will ALWAYS outspeed sand throw varients, and ohko it back. Its speed is also high enough to be a scarfed revenge killer in the same way the choice band is. It is also nice to negate things like levitate, intimidate ETC.


I can expand on this set more if people think it is actually viable. Considering it has been said that "up to this point the meta game revolves around your dory sweeping, and his being stopped".....
 

AccidentalGreed

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There seems to be the lack of what is, in my opinion...the best set up for dory, although I suppose it is because it does NOT abuse sand throw.

Rather it goes with its second (yet equally amazing) ability.

Choice scarf dory +mold breaker=amazing. It is the PERFECT counter to sand throw dory, as it will ALWAYS outspeed sand throw varients, and ohko it back. Its speed is also high enough to be a scarfed revenge killer in the same way the choice band is. It is also nice to negate things like levitate, intimidate ETC.


I can expand on this set more if people think it is actually viable. Considering it has been said that "up to this point the meta game revolves around your dory sweeping, and his being stopped".....
I get what your point is. But I don't believe that Mold Breaker works this way. How can an Excadrill with Mold Breaker outrun its Sand Power counterpart in Sandstorm? Sure, Mold Breaker can break the effect of some abilities, but not abilities such as Chlorophyll and Swift Swim or Sand Throw. (I mean, if Mold Breaker actually broke this, we would have seen Haxorus destroying Drizzle teams back then!) Mold Breaker only affects abilities that would hinder moves.
 
Cool, QC approved. I'll get to work on this in my spare time then.
valir said:
Choice scarf dory +mold breaker=amazing. It is the PERFECT counter to sand throw dory
It doesn't work that way. Sand Throw Excadrill hits 604 Speed in a sandstorm, which is many, many times faster than anything Mold Breaker Excadrill can muster even with a Choice Scarf. Don't get me wrong, Mold Breaker is an amazing ability for a Pokemon with STAB Ground-type attacks, as is Sand Power, but they are nothing compared to Sand Throw. Speed is just that important.
 

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I think he's using mold breaker to negate sand throw but it shouldn't since mold breaker only negates abilities that inhibit damage
 
Not sure if anyone has mentioned this yet, but you should list Air Balloon Magnezone as a hard counter for the CB set.

Balloon gives Magnezone immunity to Earthquake and it resists all three other attacks, while trapping for an easy kill. Return is the only thing that even threatens a 3HKO on a standard 40/0 set, though it would require significant luck, while HP Fire is a clean 2HKO. Works even better if it has more defense investment, as it can create unbreakable subs and still 2HKO. Granted, all of this is moot if Excadrill used Earthquake, since Magnezone could then do whatever it wants.

Works to a lesser extent against Swords Dance versions, but only if switching into a SD or Quake. Loses the balloon if switching into one of the secondary attacks, leaving it open to Earthquake. If successful switching, HP Fire can severely weaken Excadrill while it breaks the balloon, possibly killing it depending on previous damage and/or Life Orb recoil.
 
I feel like this is a dumb question, but if your team already has something like Skarmory or Bronzong to deal with opposing Excadrills, and you decide to run an Adamant nature, isn't it better to have a different EV spread to help take hits and still outspeed all threats? I don't know what this spread would be, but outspeeding Choice Scarfed threats isn't too hard with 88 Base Speed and Sand Rush. Any ideas of an EV spread/a stopping point for a Speed stat, regardless of this being a lesser option?

-Zane
 
I think you should include shadow claw as an option too, To hit those pesky ghost types that can give him a hard time. (gengar)
 
I think you should include shadow claw as an option too, To hit those pesky ghost types that can give him a hard time. (gengar)
[Optional Changes]

  • Shadow Claw sounds nice to hit Ghost-types that are immune to Rapid Spin, but a neutral Earthquake hits all Ghost-type Pokemon in the game except for Rotom and Gengar for the same Base Power as Shadow Claw. Both Rotom and Gengar are easily dispatched of with +2 Rock Slide.
X-Scissor has a higher base power, anyhow, for everything else.

-Zane

Edit: So I'm doing some calculations for an alternate spread with an Adamant nature... I'm guessing 252 Atk / 60 Def / 192 Spe is the best spread, as it allows Excadrill to outspeed +1 Spe base 108 opponents, and give a few more defensive EVs to reduce the OHKO rate dramatically by Choice Band Azumarill and +1 Bulk Up Conkeldurr. Are there any other faster threats? I mean, when do you see anything faster using a Choice Scarf? Not... very often, right? I think...
 
I guess you're right, my Excadrill itself has X-scisscor but Im just saying just in case someone really wants to hit that pesky ghost COUGH:";"Gengar:":"COUGH
 
I think you should include shadow claw as an option too, To hit those pesky ghost types that can give him a hard time. (gengar)
Gengar generally isn't a good switch-in to Excadrill because of Rock Slide, so Shadow Claw isn't needed to prevent Gengar from being a counter by preventing Gengar switch-ins. Conversely, Excadrill isn't a very good Gengar counter, because between Substitute and Focus Blast it has a great deal of difficulty ever switching into most modern Gengar sets.

Regular Rotom is a non-issue in OU; you'd be just as likely to see Misdreavus or Eviolite Haunter. :P Remember, the Rotom appliances aren't weak to Shadow Claw.
 
Maybe there should be a mention of Substitute on the Swords Dance set? If you can get one in before the opponent dies, you can effectively block a single priority attack, letting you kill stuff like Azumarill and Roobushin easily.
 
You really want your coverage move, usually Return, in almost all circumstances. You really can't afford to not have that 102 Base Power attack against opponents like Gliscor and the myriad other things neutral to Rock and immune to Ground. (Unless, of course, you're Rapid Spinning or using X-Scissor for specific threats)
 

SJCrew

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I feel like this is a dumb question, but if your team already has something like Skarmory or Bronzong to deal with opposing Excadrills, and you decide to run an Adamant nature, isn't it better to have a different EV spread to help take hits and still outspeed all threats? I don't know what this spread would be, but outspeeding Choice Scarfed threats isn't too hard with 88 Base Speed and Sand Rush. Any ideas of an EV spread/a stopping point for a Speed stat, regardless of this being a lesser option?

-Zane
There's really no point. Even if you can highlight something direly important that it can survive with a few random points of HP, the Balloon set depends heavily on not being hit so that it can 2HKO that Hippowdon or Landorus before they get their EQ off, and you're just going to kill yourself with LO afterward if you survive with a point of HP or two. Excadrill has no need for bulk.
 
There's really no point. Even if you can highlight something direly important that it can survive with a few random points of HP, the Balloon set depends heavily on not being hit so that it can 2HKO that Hippowdon or Landorus before they get their EQ off, and you're just going to kill yourself with LO afterward if you survive with a point of HP or two. Excadrill has no need for bulk.
Well, still, Adamant helps make up for the lost power by using Balloon, and distributes some EVs to Defense in order to survive priority a little better. Like I said, it helps Excadrill out a bit with priority, giving it a much higher chance to survive and KO some threats, which may be the only thing in the way of a sweep. After all, I'd still be using Balloon, and I would not be receiving Life Orb damage, in order to legitimately make it passed these threats. I mean, if you're using an Adamant nature, it usually implies that you're not worried about other Excadrills, which leaves room for the abandonment of a Jolly nature, the use of a Balloon, and a little bonus Defense. But is it not a superior spread, due the listed implications of running an Adamant nature? Of course, 4 / 252 / 252 spread is an option as well, in order to speed tie other (very rare) Adamant Excadrills, and (basically nonexistent, to my knowledge) Choice Scarf 110+ base speed threats. But I do not see that as a superior option, considering Excadrill is covered by a team mate, and anything faster is almost unused in competitive Pokémon (and will stay that way, due to their inability to outspeed the more common Jolly Excadrill).

-Zane

P.S. I don't really understand what you meant, though, when you referenced to Hippowdon and Landorus. My proposed spread can still 2HKO these threats. I hadn't elaborated that I'd choose Balloon over Life Orb, most likely, but the use of Balloon is the defining factor as to whether Excadrill can KO Hippowdon and Landorus or not, regardless of nature (or Speed, really). And yeah, sure, Excadrill has no need for bulk... But, the way I see it, it has no need for the excess Speed EVs, either. I'm just trying to clarify this for my own in-game Excadrill, before I EV train it (and BW EV training sucks without the EV berries :c ). I don't want to waste the 60 EVs in case I really AM overlooking a huge flaw in this spread (which I don't believe I am).

P.P.S. Actually, compare this argument to your opinion that Weavile should run 40 HP EVs from Speed because it doesn't become outsped any significant threats. Same thing goes for Adamant Excadrill, in my opinion.
 
You run max Speed on Adamant Excadrill to have a shot at winning a Speed tie against other people that may run Adamant Excadrill. Weavile vs. Weavile, in your analogy, is an extraordinarily rare scenario, and isn't worth running max Speed for. Many a match has been won or lost by an Excadrill Speed tie in BW.
 
You run max Speed on Adamant Excadrill to have a shot at winning a Speed tie against other people that may run Adamant Excadrill. Weavile vs. Weavile, in your analogy, is an extraordinarily rare scenario, and isn't worth running max Speed for. Many a match has been won or lost by an Excadrill Speed tie in BW.
Thanks for the response! But an Adamant speed tie? That is honestly not something I'd risk my Excadrill for, considering I would have almost no way to decipher whether or not the opposing Excadrill is Adamant. Not to mention, most are Jolly for this purpose. That is why I would have something else handle enemy Excadrill, in general.

-Zane
 

SJCrew

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I don't really understand what you meant, though, when you referenced to Hippowdon and Landorus.
Once the Balloon breaks from taking an attack, you're vulnerable to EQ from the threats you needed it to 2HKO. We still don't know what this attack is, since you haven't specified.

The point is that here's nothing that imporant Exca is ensured to survive with more HP EVs to give up the chance in hell you have of winning speed ties with Adamant, unless you're willing to do the work and find it out. If neither max Speed nor bulk are especially dire, then the greater necessity takes priority. You should want to at least beat Adamant Exca rather than pander to your paranoia about surviving some unknown attack.

I don't necessarily think your proposal is inherently flawed, it just requires more research. Once you find that important threat it can take a hit from, make sure you make this applicable to Balloon and only Balloon, since you're not going to get away with it on LO.
 
am zane ok. said:
Thanks for the response! But an Adamant speed tie? That is honestly not something I'd risk my Excadrill for, considering I would have almost no way to decipher whether or not the opposing Excadrill is Adamant. Not to mention, most are Jolly for this purpose. That is why I would have something else handle enemy Excadrill, in general.
The point is that you don't always have that luxury. Even if you have other things to deal with Excadrill, many times you will be facing down a Speed tie with an opposing Excadrill and have nothing left to send in. In those cases, I'd much rather have a 50% chance of beating Adamant variants than a 0% chance to beat any variant, especially not at the cost of some negligible amount of added bulk.
 
The point is that you don't always have that luxury. Even if you have other things to deal with Excadrill, many times you will be facing down a Speed tie with an opposing Excadrill and have nothing left to send in. In those cases, I'd much rather have a 50% chance of beating Adamant variants than a 0% chance to beat any variant, especially not at the cost of some negligible amount of added bulk.
I'm not sure how much different the Wifi metagame is compared to the PO metagame... But I understand. I do have a 31 Speed IV Jolly Excadrill (along with a 31 Attack and Speed IV Adamant Excadrill) in my box, though, so I may just switch to Jolly all together. (I never realized how easy IV breeding is... Or maybe I just got lucky. I'm still probably never doing this again, though. lol.)

I think I'll just switch to Jolly. And I guess it's not as if Gliscor/Skarmory and Jellicent can't handle the threats that the defense EVs actually help with.

Guess my spread's conclusively debunked. What a weird metagame this is!

-Zane
 

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[Overview]

<p>Excadrill is a legend amongst the Pokemon introduced in BW, and is infamous for its ideally distributed stats and unbelievable sweeping potential in a sandstorm. Hitting a raw Speed stat of 604 in a sandstorm with no setup whatsoever, Excadrill outspeeds Deoxys-S and even base 130 Speed Pokemon with a Choice Scarf. It's absurd to think that it gets even better than that, though, but for example, access to Rapid Spin makes Excadrill an even better offensive Rapid Spinner than even Starmie ever was. You'd also think that such an offensive Pokemon would be very frail, but no, in fact, Excadrill has enough bulk to avoid being OHKOed by pretty much any neutral attack, and has a typing that affords it numerous resistances to take advantage of and key immunities to Thunder Wave and poison. After you look at all of Excadrill's seemingly boundless strengths, it's no wonder why it's atop everyone's threat list this generation.</p>

<p>Excadrill is a phenomenal Pokemon, and the only reason it isn't banned is because there still exist Pokemon that can beat it and Excadrill still has weaknesses that can be exploited. Powerful priority, such as Mach Punch from Conkeldurr or Aqua Jet from Azumarill, tears Excadrill down. Also, one of the biggest issues with Excadrill is that Drought Ninetales and Drizzle Politoed exist. If the weather isn't favorable for Excadrill, a huge list of Pokemon crop up as checks and counters to it. Furthermore, while Excadrill's type coverage is spectacular, its three move coverage almost always leaves it vulnerable to something, such as Bronzong when lacking X-Scissor. These things come together to make Excadrill more balanced than you might be led to believe, but nonetheless it remains as one of the most threatening Pokemon that exist.</p>

[SET]
name: Swords Dance
move 1: Swords Dance
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Rock Slide
move 4: Return / Rapid Spin / X-Scissor
item: Air Balloon / Life Orb
ability: Sand Rush
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Excadrill is an insanely powerful sweeper that can cleave teams in half if they lack one of the few adequate checks to him, and even sometimes even if they do if you've properly supported Excadrill with your team. Base 135 Attack coupled with base 88 Speed and Sand Rush, which doubles Speed in a sandstorm, makes Excadrill the monster we know him as. Swords Dance was made for a Pokemon like this, and after a single boost, Excadrill's Attack hits 738 or 810 with a Jolly and Adamant nature, respectively.</p>

<p>The truth is that Excadrill's attacking movepool isn't overflowing with options, but has all of the right moves in all of the right places to get the job done. Earthquake is Excadrill's STAB, and it is so powerful after a boost that even Pokemon that resist it aren't completely safe. Rock Slide is used alongside Earthquake for great neutral coverage against myriad threats. In the last slot, Excadrill has a lot of very good options to choose from. Return is the most popular, as it hits Pokemon like Rotom-W, Gliscor, and Landorus the hardest of all available options. Rapid Spin is also a very effective tool for that last slot, however, if you're not looking for added coverage. It's no joke to claim that Excadrill is the best Rapid Spinner that exists, especially considering that no Ghost-type will switch in for fear of a powerful attack. Lastly, X-Scissor is a good choice for hitting Bronzong for neutral damage and annihilating Grass-, Psychic-, and Dark-types after a boost.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>The EV spread is standard for an offensive sweeper. It might not make much sense to run max Speed and a Jolly nature with Sand Rush boosting Excadrill's Speed, but more often than not, you'll be facing down an opposing Excadrill and have to risk the Speed tie. This is also why Jolly is recommended over Adamant, as even though Jolly is overkill, you really need to beat opposing Excadrill. Adamant is still an option, however, as it adds considerable punch to Excadrill's attacks, especially after a boost. Adamant is also exceptional when run with Air Balloon, since it prevents opposing Excadrill from hitting your Excadrill super effectively if kept intact. Speaking of Air Balloon, it's the primary option for Excadrill's item because many Pokemon cannot do significant damage to Excadrill without first popping it. Gliscor, for instance, risks allowing Excadrill to set up a second Swords Dance if it first has to pop Excadrill's Air Balloon with a weak Ice Fang or other attack. Life Orb is still an exceptional item, however, as it allows Excadrill to annihilate Pokemon and sweep very easily with just one boost. Leftovers is also a useful item when running Rapid Spin to keep Excadrill around longer, though even in that case, Air Balloon tends to be more valuable. Chople Berry is also a good item to consider using, as many teams rely on Mach Punch from the likes of Conkeldurr to beat Excadrill. Lastly, despite hopefully being obvious, Sand Rush is the best ability on Excadrill. Sand Force is a great ability and all, but just doesn't make up for the fact that Excadrill really wants to outspeed nigh-everything in the game.</p>

<p>The first thing you should always bring in your team when using Excadrill is something with Sand Stream. The best Pokemon for this job is Tyranitar, as it can be tailored to beat many Pokemon, including Gliscor and Skarmory with Ice Beam and Fire Blast, respectively, paving the way for an Excadrill sweep. Hippowdon is also a good choice, as it can tank physical hits extremely well and check opposing Excadrill. Running Hippowdon over Tyranitar also makes Adamant Excadrill more workable, since you have a solid check to opposing Excadrill. If running Rapid Spin, Excadrill partners particularly well with Pokemon such as Thundurus and Volcarona. Both of these Pokemon can switch into typical attacks aimed at Excadrill and annihilate its checks to allow for an eventual sweep. In general, it's also good to pair up Excadrill with another powerful Ground-type sweeper like Landorus or Garchomp, as one of them can sufficiently weaken their mutual counters and enable an Excadrill sweep or vice versa.</p>

[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Earthquake
move 2: Rock Slide
move 3: Return
move 4: X-Scissor
item: Choice Band
ability: Sand Rush
nature: Jolly / Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]

<p>Sometimes, Excadrill just doesn't get the opportunity to set up a Swords Dance, and so would much rather hit really hard off the bat instead. Choice Band gives Excadrill that power, and actually helps it so much that it can immediately threaten some Pokemon that might otherwise check it very effectively, such as Hippowdon. By giving up a setup move, Excadrill is able to run its optimal four move coverage in Earthquake, Rock Slide, Return, and X-Scissor. Nothing in the game resists all of these moves, and many Pokemon are outright 2HKOed with the appropriate one.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>There's never any reason for Excadrill to run any EV spread other than 252 Attack and 252 Speed. The little bulk given by investing slightly in HP and removing some from Speed is never worth the chance of losing a Speed tie to opposing Excadrill. Jolly is the primary nature choice to at worst tie opposing Excadrill, though with a Choice Band boosting Excadrill's Attack stat, Adamant becomes an even more attractive alternative. Sand Throw, unsurprisingly, is the ability of choice for the Speed boost. As appealing as Sand Force might be for the bonus damage, it's not as excellent as the raw Speed that Sand Throw offers.</p>

<p>When running Choice Band Excadrill, it's imperative to run it alongside other Ground-type sweepers such as Landorus and Garchomp. One of the biggest lures of the immediate power of a Choice Band is to soften up Pokemon like Bronzong, Gliscor, Hippowdon, and Gyarados for one of your other sweepers to break through later. Also, when using Excadrill, don't forget to pack either Tyranitar or a Hippowdon of your own to set up a sandstorm. Choice Band Excadrill also appreciates Spikes and Stealth Rock a lot, since checks like Gyarados and Hippowdon will be easily 2HKOed with the appropriate move after they take enough residual damage. Skarmory is usually the better choice for setting up Spikes despite the fact that it doubles up on Excadrill's Fire-type weakness since it will also lure Electric-type attacks for Excadrill to switch in against.</p>

[Other Options]

<p>There's a good reason why Excadrill is forced to use moves like Return and X-Scissor for coverage, and that's because it has virtually no other attacking moves worth using. Brick Break can be run as a coverage move to nail opposing Excadrill that are floating on an Air Balloon, but otherwise has basically no utility; basically everything else vulnerable to Brick Break, namely Tyranitar and Ferrothorn, are hit equally hard by Earthquake. Shadow Claw might sound nice to hit Ghost-types that are immune to Rapid Spin, but a neutral Earthquake hits all Ghost-type Pokemon in the game except for Rotom and Gengar for the same Base Power as Shadow Claw. Additionally, both Rotom and Gengar are easily dispatched of with a boosted Rock Slide. Excadrill can run Hone Claws over Swords Dance for setting up so that Rock Slide will never miss, though this is basically always inferior to just chancing Rock Slide's accuracy with a Swords Dance boost.</p>

[Checks and Counters]

<p>Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on how you look at it, there is quite a substantial list of Pokemon that adequately check Excadrill. Bronzong and Skarmory are the best of the best, though, as nothing Excadrill can do will seriously hurt them even after a Swords Dance boost. Skarmory can't really do anything back to Excadrill other than break its Air Balloon with Brave Bird and then Whirlwind it away, though, and Bronzong needs to be mindful of a boosted X-Scissor. Gliscor is another spectacular switch-in to Excadrill and can break Excadrill's Air Balloon with Ice Fang, though with Poison Heal lacks Roost and so can be worn down over a match if not careful. Hippowdon is another solid check, though can be beaten by repeated boosted Earthquakes if Excadrill has its Air Balloon intact.</p>

<p>Outside of the aforementioned bulky Ground- and Steel-types, Pokemon with an Air Balloon of their own intact and a resistance to coverage moves can beat Excadrill. A good example of this is Air Balloon Heatran, which can OHKO Excadrill with Fire Blast. When nothing else works, an Excadrill of your own forces the opposing Excadrill into a Speed tie that can save you the match. Lastly, anything that changes weather away from sandstorm will nullify Excadrill's ability and make it much easier to check with faster Pokemon packing super effective moves.</p>

<p>As a final note, it's worth having at least two reasonable checks to Excadrill on your team. It's very likely that Excadrill is paired up with fellow Ground-types Landorus or Garchomp to beat through their mutual checks. If you only have one of these checks and Excadrill sufficiently weakens it, it's likely that you will be at risk of being swept by the second-string Ground-type sweeper.</p>

[Dream World]

<p>Mold Breaker, while amazing with Ground-type STAB for hitting Pokemon with Levitate or that are using an Air Balloon, is very nearly useless compared to Sand Rush on Excadrill. In practice, Excadrill relies on its immense and incomparable Speed stat to beat many Pokemon that would otherwise stop him cold, always making Mold Breaker an inferior ability by comparison.</p>

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