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Unreleased OU
- Thread starter The Immortal
- Start date
In theory, if I'm not mistaken, Smeargle would be the only Pokemon capable of using them. Zygarde obviously hasn't been confirmed as the recipient of those moves yet.
The thing is, Smeargle is technically incapable of having them unless it has a Sketch target, right?
I wonder if you could get it from metronome though? Pretty sure even when it was first introduced as a signature move for ho-oh you could metronome out sacredfire. If so then all you'd need is for the move to be coded into the game technically.
A quick search shows that you couldn't get V-create, Ice Burn, Freeze Shock, Techno Blast, or Secret Sword through metronome in gen 5. It's not unreasonable to assume they'd do something similar for gen 6 and its event-exclusive moves like Steam Eruption and Light of Ruin.
I honestly think that there'll be flags in Pokebank specifically for this kinda stuff on release day, but just in case there aren't, I'm gonna compile a list of very tentatively possible glitchmons - just the OU viable ones - that can be altered into legal, bank-compatible 'mons with new moves.
- Nidoking might get Psychic from 'LM4' (and possibly Hydro Pump/Sleep Powder, but it might get too glitchy to work)
- Magnemite/-ton/-zone might get Fire Blast and Earthquake. (not sure if it'll default to gen 3's Magnet Pull or Sturdy upon transfer)
- Arcanine might get Earthquake and Softboiled/Recover (only through fossil conversion glitch, and even then, I'm not sure it's a done deal. It might be enough to make it OU viable though). It might also get Explosion and Swords Dance, but not in tandem with the other moves.
- Whether it gets magnet pull or not is actually completely random because of the fact that there aren't abilities in gen one, at least judging from how you get clefable with mg and softboiled w/o ability capsules (cute charm 1 vs cute charm 2). If it gets fire blast, then its abilities as a steel trapper will actually increase greatly with it being able to run scarf and still blow ferro into another dimension, and eq could be cool for luring random heatrans. (no epower i cri errtime)
SketchUp
Don't let your memes be dreams
Volcanion @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 88 HP / 240 SpA / 180 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Toxic
- Protect
This is by far my favorite Volcanion set. Water Absorb is really cool to beat bulky water types but you will lose 1v1 against most Water-Types such as Slowbro, Recover Starmie, and Quagsire. Toxic is in my opinion one of the most valuable moves for Volcanion because it enables it to beat these Water Types, while you can also hurt dragon types and specially bulky pokemon like Goodra, Latias and Chansey (although Natural Cure + Heal Bell is a thing, the chip damage still come in handy) It has the advantages over Steam Eruption burns that you status them 90% of the time instead of 30% and that it does more damage when the opponent stays in longer, for example in situations like CM Slowbro. Protect does not only help stacking up the Toxic damage in a similar way as Protect / Toxic Heatran tries to stall out Latias, but it also let the opponent take another 12% burn damage and you recover 1/16th of your health due to Leftovers. Scouting against Choice locked pokemon like Landorus-T and Keldeo is a nice thing too but it obviously isn't the main utility of Protect.
Volcanion @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Overheat
- Sludge Bomb
- Haze
This set is a bit less obvious (and a bit worse) but it is so fun to use. Shuca Berry to lure in offensive ground types like Landorus-T and Diggersby. I don't think it's a really good item but I don't like the recoil from Life Orb and I've never played with Mystic Water or other items like that. I got the idea behind Haze + Overheat from a Dragalge set back when it was RU (Haze + Draco) and it is a really fun combination. Overheat drops your SpA and Haze makes up for it. The main thing I liked about Haze however isn't too compensate Overheat but to annoy setup sweepers like CM Slowbro, Clefable, DDD Mega Altaria and BD Azumarill. Sludge Bomb finishes Azumarill after a BD (except if it's still at 75% but Haze+Sludge Bomb will always beat Azu here), does a lot to Offensive DD Mega Altaria after you survive the Earthquake because of Shuca, and has a decent chance to beat Clefable in a 1v1 situation (odds are against you because Sludge Bomb only has a 2% chance to 2HKO with Leftovers, but Clefable can't do much back and you can Haze away its boosts) This set is more for fun but it can also work as a lure to pokemon like Landorus-T and Mega Altaria to support other winconditions.
Quick Note:
Because Eevee gets Reflect, every Evolution of Eevee should also get Reflect, not just the Gen 1 Pokemon. It currently has Reflect Umbreon listed as illegal when it should be legal. (The same is true for Bide Steelix, though Bide has fewer applications than Gen 1 Reflect distribution)
Because Eevee gets Reflect, every Evolution of Eevee should also get Reflect, not just the Gen 1 Pokemon. It currently has Reflect Umbreon listed as illegal when it should be legal. (The same is true for Bide Steelix, though Bide has fewer applications than Gen 1 Reflect distribution)
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Actually I want to give my own spread for the Shuca Berry set that I found to be very reliable:
Volcanion @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 88 HP / 240 SpA / 180 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Toxic
- Protect
This is by far my favorite Volcanion set. Water Absorb is really cool to beat bulky water types but you will lose 1v1 against most Water-Types such as Slowbro, Recover Starmie, and Quagsire. Toxic is in my opinion one of the most valuable moves for Volcanion because it enables it to beat these Water Types, while you can also hurt dragon types and specially bulky pokemon like Goodra, Latias and Chansey (although Natural Cure + Heal Bell is a thing, the chip damage still come in handy) It has the advantages over Steam Eruption burns that you status them 90% of the time instead of 30% and that it does more damage when the opponent stays in longer, for example in situations like CM Slowbro. Protect does not only help stacking up the Toxic damage in a similar way as Protect / Toxic Heatran tries to stall out Latias, but it also let the opponent take another 12% burn damage and you recover 1/16th of your health due to Leftovers. Scouting against Choice locked pokemon like Landorus-T and Keldeo is a nice thing too but it obviously isn't the main utility of Protect.
Volcanion @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Steam Eruption
- Overheat
- Sludge Bomb
- Haze
This set is a bit less obvious (and a bit worse) but it is so fun to use. Shuca Berry to lure in offensive ground types like Landorus-T and Diggersby. I don't think it's a really good item but I don't like the recoil from Life Orb and I've never played with Mystic Water or other items like that. I got the idea behind Haze + Overheat from a Dragalge set back when it was RU (Haze + Draco) and it is a really fun combination. Overheat drops your SpA and Haze makes up for it. The main thing I liked about Haze however isn't too compensate Overheat but to annoy setup sweepers like CM Slowbro, Clefable, DDD Mega Altaria and BD Azumarill. Sludge Bomb finishes Azumarill after a BD (except if it's still at 75% but Haze+Sludge Bomb will always beat Azu here), does a lot to Offensive DD Mega Altaria after you survive the Earthquake because of Shuca, and has a decent chance to beat Clefable in a 1v1 situation (odds are against you because Sludge Bomb only has a 2% chance to 2HKO with Leftovers, but Clefable can't do much back and you can Haze away its boosts) This set is more for fun but it can also work as a lure to pokemon like Landorus-T and Mega Altaria to support other winconditions.
Volcanion @ Shuca Berry
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 96 HP / 232 SpA / 180 Spe
IVs: 30 SpA
Modest Nature
- Steam Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Sludge Wave
- Hidden Power Electric
The idea is still the same with the set, although I went with more of an All-Out-Attacker set for Shuca Berry Volcanion. The spread was crafted to outspeed 8 Speed Landorus-T while also being able to do this:
252+ Atk Life Orb Excadrill Earthquake vs. 96 HP / 0 Def Shuca Berry Volcanion: 207-243 (63.6 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
The ability to revenge kill Excadrill and other Ground mons is a huge boon for Volcanion, and of course it still hits hard as hell with its great 130 Special Attack and strong STAB's. I love this set alot and it shows how strong this mon really is.
The team builder doesn't show RBY moves as they aren't part of the learnsets; Unreleased OU is a mod. If you click validate (while your format is set as Unreleased OU), or try to battle, it will be allowed.
Volcanion w/ choice specs is op
Looking through the moveset, I think Magnemite might get Aurora Beam too. Not the most useful thing, but in the event that you want to run it over HP Ice for Lando and Garchomp...
Why did the writer take notice of the Regis? You can get they're hidden ability these days with Pokemon Bank. So why it's listed?
This was made just before the Regi announcement.
Has Smogon ever considered allowing the use of movesets that are the result of glitching? When these hypothetical movesets become available what are the chances of Smogon actually allowing them? Sounds kinda dumb if you ask me...
It depends on the scale and severity of the glitch, or so I'd hope. Gen 4's Mimic Glitch was obviously disallowed, seeing as it made a lot of things (Ursaring, of all things!) viciously overpowered. Psychic on Nido doesn't look like the end of the world, as things go, and even Magnezone gaining the ability to whack Heatran might still be fair game as far as the meta is concerned.
It could be that glitches are banned from Smogon on principle, which I'm also okay with, but it bears mentioning that it can go either way here, seeing as the glitch's "offenses" are far less egregious this time around. I mean, the gen 1 ladder keeps the 255/511 HP recovery failure glitch, so it isn't unprecedented to allow glitches in.
Keep in mind, though, that there are a LOT of gen 1 glitches. Pokemon merge glitches, unstable hybrids, fossil conversion glitches, the whole nine yards. To my knowledge, any glitch that introduces a severely broken Pokemon is of the savefile-corrupting variety, so I'm gonna go out on a limb and call it home free from here.
EDIT: On closer analysis, the merge glitch could be more powerful than initially anticipated. Essentially, it makes a Pokemon sacrifice its TM/HM compatitbility and learnset for another. As a result, a Venusaur can potentially sacrifice its moveset in return for Charizard's. These unstable hybrids can be stabilized and made legal for trade, and it has been proven true for gen 1 to gen 2 trades, as tested about 7-8 years ago by dedicated glitch-testers. This only becomes more powerful, as I imagine that transferring to Pokebank will most likely 'repair' the moveset back to its original set, giving it access to a different Pokemon's gen 1 learnset, and its original's gen 6/7 moveset. For documentation purposes of some really interesting cases:
- A Magnemite can potentially gain Fire Blast, Ice Beam and Earthquake.
- A Charizard can potentially gain access to Crabhammer.
- Gyarados can potentially gain Fire Punch.
- Everything above, as well as Dragonite and Aerodactyl, can potentially gain High Jump Kick.
- Gengar can potentially get Fire Blast and Ice Beam.
- By now, the point is made. Every gen 1 special attacker can potentially make use of Fire Blast/Ice Beam/Thunderbolt/Earthquake (as well as Hydro Pump/Psychic for those that don't care about these 4), and every physical attacker gains only one out of Fire Punch/Ice Punch/Thunder Punch, Crabhammer/Waterfall or High Jump Kick. The slashes are moves you can get together, and anything outside of them are separate glitch sets and cannot be combined. Rock Slide is omitted, as anything that can potentially get it has better options anyways.
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I just don't want future OU to turn into what amounts to basically hackmons. Broken or not these movesets are not natural at all. Also, although it doesn't matter to the discussion much, OU teams are hard enough to replicate in a cartridge game as it is. I'm very much against glitched movesets
There's a very high chance that these glitched movesets won't get through Pokebank to begin with. The entire point of my previous post was more for documentation purposes, on the extreme off-chance that it both gets through Pokebank, and Smogon allows it. I'd say the chance is near zero, but it's still worth putting down in text form, I'd assume.
does berserk gene count as an unreleased item? it isnt listed
I'm pretty sure it doesn't even exist in the game data anymore.
that sucks. berserk gene+purugly memes would have been funny.
I highly doubt we the OU council are going to be advocating glitched movesets into the fray and on the off chance we're going to entertain a serious discussion in the future in some sort of policy review thread just know I'm going to be 100% against glitched movesets to be used in OU. If you can get it within normal means provided by GameFreak / Nintendo company then that's a different story but this seems more than likely not the case with these specific scenarios. I don't follow this thread though but felt the need to clarify on that.