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The Top 10 Titans of the 5th Gen NU Metagame [General Discussion]
- Thread starter Lasagne
- Start date
Nominating Zangoose
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Since Zangoose is my favorite pokemon of all time, I obviously added it to my NU team. I gave it the set Quick attack, Swords dance, Facade and CCombat. It didn't perform too well, but I found a zangoose using Protect, so I swapped Swords Dance out for it. Then I had problems with protect spammers, so I gave my zangoose Feint to fight against it. This set was great for me, and rarely failed for me, and I gave feint a good use for once.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Sweeper and Sweeper only. It had a good time against everything except for ghost types.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
It saved me in a battle that I thought I had no hope of beating once. I also nearly swept the floor with the opponent.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Priority, bro. Zangoose has bad defenses, so Mach punch or Extremespeed can make mince meat out of it. Thankfully it isn't too common in NU, and Feint stops it nicely, so not too much of a problem for me.
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Since Zangoose is my favorite pokemon of all time, I obviously added it to my NU team. I gave it the set Quick attack, Swords dance, Facade and CCombat. It didn't perform too well, but I found a zangoose using Protect, so I swapped Swords Dance out for it. Then I had problems with protect spammers, so I gave my zangoose Feint to fight against it. This set was great for me, and rarely failed for me, and I gave feint a good use for once.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Sweeper and Sweeper only. It had a good time against everything except for ghost types.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
It saved me in a battle that I thought I had no hope of beating once. I also nearly swept the floor with the opponent.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Priority, bro. Zangoose has bad defenses, so Mach punch or Extremespeed can make mince meat out of it. Thankfully it isn't too common in NU, and Feint stops it nicely, so not too much of a problem for me.
That's nice and all, but I reckon your article is a) on the short side and b) is more about your personal experience with using this guy rather than him throughout the entire BW2 NU meta. I guess he might be a contender because there was a time that he was close to being suspected, but if you want to nominate him, do so by being more explicit and shining a light on him throughout the whole meta.Nominating Zangoose
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Since Zangoose is my favorite pokemon of all time, I obviously added it to my NU team. I gave it the set Quick attack, Swords dance, Facade and CCombat. It didn't perform too well, but I found a zangoose using Protect, so I swapped Swords Dance out for it. Then I had problems with protect spammers, so I gave my zangoose Feint to fight against it. This set was great for me, and rarely failed for me, and I gave feint a good use for once.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Sweeper and Sweeper only. It had a good time against everything except for ghost types.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
It saved me in a battle that I thought I had no hope of beating once. I also nearly swept the floor with the opponent.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Priority, bro. Zangoose has bad defenses, so Mach punch or Extremespeed can make mince meat out of it. Thankfully it isn't too common in NU, and Feint stops it nicely, so not too much of a problem for me.
Musharna was a monster tho, Untill scolipede and friends came to stop its bullshit. I played around that time and it was so easy to use and hard to stop. Skuntank on all the teams!
Robert alfons is right. I'd be perfectly fine with zangoose being a nominee, but most of your sections are too short, and the post is too personalized. You have to go into what zangoose is like in general, not just stating your experiences with it.Nominating Zangoose
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Since Zangoose is my favorite pokemon of all time, I obviously added it to my NU team. I gave it the set Quick attack, Swords dance, Facade and CCombat. It didn't perform too well, but I found a zangoose using Protect, so I swapped Swords Dance out for it. Then I had problems with protect spammers, so I gave my zangoose Feint to fight against it. This set was great for me, and rarely failed for me, and I gave feint a good use for once.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Sweeper and Sweeper only. It had a good time against everything except for ghost types.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
It saved me in a battle that I thought I had no hope of beating once. I also nearly swept the floor with the opponent.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Priority, bro. Zangoose has bad defenses, so Mach punch or Extremespeed can make mince meat out of it. Thankfully it isn't too common in NU, and Feint stops it nicely, so not too much of a problem for me.
Writing up Zangoose.
Zangoose
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Zangoose has always lurked around in NU, but back then it was just your regular Normal-type with high Attack and good Speed: 115 Attack and 90 Speed are by no means bad. However, the existance of other Normal-types such as Swellow, Braviary, Tauros, Kangaskhan, Ursaring and Cincinno were either much faster, much stronger, or in Kanga's case more reliable, so there really wasn't any point to using Zangoose over a more effective Normal-type. That is until it received its DW ability Toxic Boost, which bolstered it as a threat so much that it leaped nearly 80 spots in usage and was even nominated as a suspect in Stage 5, due to the perfect neutral coverage it always had combined with its newfound power. Carving its name down as one of the most powerful Normal-types, if not attackers in NU, Zangoose terrorized almost everything slower than it with its nearly unparallaled strength, and above average speed for its time meant that those range of targets is wide. Never mind that its health is decreasing every turn, it is unlikely your team would be in better condition by the time Zangoose drops dead.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Effective but one-dimensional, Zangoose aims for nothing more than to rip its opponents to shreds. However, how one did it was another story altogether. The item choice is obviously and should always be Toxic Orb: using Life Orb or Choice Band would be completely redundant whereas Choice Scarf is done better by Tauros or Kangaskhan who have more useful abilities. Zangoose has 5 moves to choose from: Facade, Close Combat, Night Slash, Swords Dance, and Quick Attack. Unfortunately it cannot fit all of them into the same moveset, so Zangoose often has to choose between KOing walls with Swords Dance, threatening sweepers with Quick Attack, or do both while giving up a coverage move. Zangoose's main prey are slower targets that get KOed easily by its attacks, and capitalize on the fact that few dare to switch in on it.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
Swords Danced Toxic Boost poisoned-Facade. Name me one non-Normal resist that can switch into this without risking a OHKO....I thought so. Even its non-Swords Danced Facade was hard enough to switch into for most Pokemon. Zangoose's claim to fame is that between its boosting move, perfect neutral coverage and even priority, Zangoose has the potential to KO anything in the tier. Rock- or Steel-types get pummeled by Close Combat, Ghosts are shredded by Night Slash, and any revenge killer had better be in good shape lest a Quick Attack pick them off. It is notoriously difficult to avoid losing a pokemon to Zangoose, since the only pokemon that can survive Zangoose's attacks are slower than it (those switching into Zangoose are exposed to 2 hits or worse, Swords Dance), while those faster than Zangoose cannot switch in at all unless they come in on a weaker/resisted attack.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Zangoose suffers from a design flaw: it needs to wait a turn to activate Toxic Boost. This is pretty much the best window of opportunity for your faster sweeper to switch in on its unboosted attacks and threaten it out or KO it due to its dwindling health and poor defenses, the latter of which could be further dropped by the use of Close Combat. This isn't always that simple however, as Zangoose may Swords Dance on the switch and use the subsequent Toxic Boost to overpower your faster pokemon with Quick Attack, or Zangoose can activate Toxic Orb without having to waste a turn via a teammate's Volt Switch/U-turn/Baton Pass. The former makes Haunter a special case, as it is faster than Zangoose and immune to Quick Attack, making it a great offensive answer to Zangoose, while Intimidate Tauros can cushion the blow. Defending against Zangoose is much harder due to its power, but since it is losing health every turn, predicting around Zangoose's attacks using the team's resistances and defensive synergy, or stalling it with Protect or Substitute, can still overcome the cat ferret, even without actually fighting back. A Zangoose without Swords Dance is going to have much more trouble against the likes of Tangela, Alomomola, Armaldo, Torkoal and Regirock, all of which can survive the attack and either outstall Zangoose so it succumbs to poison or attack it directly to speed up the process. Zangoose's fraility also made Swords Dance tricky to use in the first place, so that offers yet another chance to whittle it down before it gets going. Finally, priority targets Zangoose's frail defenses and bypasses its speed stat, or force it to use Quick Attack to overtake slower priority users. Even if the attack does not KO, any extra damage on Zangoose shortens its lifespan and resultantly sweeping time. Pokemon such as Carracosta, Swellow, Piloswine, Gurdurr and Skuntank are all popular priority users that can pressure Zangoose, though keep in mind a slower Sucker Punch fails against Quick Attack. While circumstantial, if you can make Zangoose lose its Toxic Orb via Trick or Knock Off before it activates or inflict it with any status aside from poison, Zangoose is effectively neutered, although Facade is still boosted from paralysis and burn.
Zangoose
What effect did Zangoose have on the metagame?
Zangoose has always lurked around in NU, but back then it was just your regular Normal-type with high Attack and good Speed: 115 Attack and 90 Speed are by no means bad. However, the existance of other Normal-types such as Swellow, Braviary, Tauros, Kangaskhan, Ursaring and Cincinno were either much faster, much stronger, or in Kanga's case more reliable, so there really wasn't any point to using Zangoose over a more effective Normal-type. That is until it received its DW ability Toxic Boost, which bolstered it as a threat so much that it leaped nearly 80 spots in usage and was even nominated as a suspect in Stage 5, due to the perfect neutral coverage it always had combined with its newfound power. Carving its name down as one of the most powerful Normal-types, if not attackers in NU, Zangoose terrorized almost everything slower than it with its nearly unparallaled strength, and above average speed for its time meant that those range of targets is wide. Never mind that its health is decreasing every turn, it is unlikely your team would be in better condition by the time Zangoose drops dead.
In what main roles was Zangoose used?
Effective but one-dimensional, Zangoose aims for nothing more than to rip its opponents to shreds. However, how one did it was another story altogether. The item choice is obviously and should always be Toxic Orb: using Life Orb or Choice Band would be completely redundant whereas Choice Scarf is done better by Tauros or Kangaskhan who have more useful abilities. Zangoose has 5 moves to choose from: Facade, Close Combat, Night Slash, Swords Dance, and Quick Attack. Unfortunately it cannot fit all of them into the same moveset, so Zangoose often has to choose between KOing walls with Swords Dance, threatening sweepers with Quick Attack, or do both while giving up a coverage move. Zangoose's main prey are slower targets that get KOed easily by its attacks, and capitalize on the fact that few dare to switch in on it.
What caused it to have a significant impact?
Swords Danced Toxic Boost poisoned-Facade. Name me one non-Normal resist that can switch into this without risking a OHKO....I thought so. Even its non-Swords Danced Facade was hard enough to switch into for most Pokemon. Zangoose's claim to fame is that between its boosting move, perfect neutral coverage and even priority, Zangoose has the potential to KO anything in the tier. Rock- or Steel-types get pummeled by Close Combat, Ghosts are shredded by Night Slash, and any revenge killer had better be in good shape lest a Quick Attack pick them off. It is notoriously difficult to avoid losing a pokemon to Zangoose, since the only pokemon that can survive Zangoose's attacks are slower than it (those switching into Zangoose are exposed to 2 hits or worse, Swords Dance), while those faster than Zangoose cannot switch in at all unless they come in on a weaker/resisted attack.
How do/did you deal with this Pokemon in NU?
Zangoose suffers from a design flaw: it needs to wait a turn to activate Toxic Boost. This is pretty much the best window of opportunity for your faster sweeper to switch in on its unboosted attacks and threaten it out or KO it due to its dwindling health and poor defenses, the latter of which could be further dropped by the use of Close Combat. This isn't always that simple however, as Zangoose may Swords Dance on the switch and use the subsequent Toxic Boost to overpower your faster pokemon with Quick Attack, or Zangoose can activate Toxic Orb without having to waste a turn via a teammate's Volt Switch/U-turn/Baton Pass. The former makes Haunter a special case, as it is faster than Zangoose and immune to Quick Attack, making it a great offensive answer to Zangoose, while Intimidate Tauros can cushion the blow. Defending against Zangoose is much harder due to its power, but since it is losing health every turn, predicting around Zangoose's attacks using the team's resistances and defensive synergy, or stalling it with Protect or Substitute, can still overcome the cat ferret, even without actually fighting back. A Zangoose without Swords Dance is going to have much more trouble against the likes of Tangela, Alomomola, Armaldo, Torkoal and Regirock, all of which can survive the attack and either outstall Zangoose so it succumbs to poison or attack it directly to speed up the process. Zangoose's fraility also made Swords Dance tricky to use in the first place, so that offers yet another chance to whittle it down before it gets going. Finally, priority targets Zangoose's frail defenses and bypasses its speed stat, or force it to use Quick Attack to overtake slower priority users. Even if the attack does not KO, any extra damage on Zangoose shortens its lifespan and resultantly sweeping time. Pokemon such as Carracosta, Swellow, Piloswine, Gurdurr and Skuntank are all popular priority users that can pressure Zangoose, though keep in mind a slower Sucker Punch fails against Quick Attack. While circumstantial, if you can make Zangoose lose its Toxic Orb via Trick or Knock Off before it activates or inflict it with any status aside from poison, Zangoose is effectively neutered, although Facade is still boosted from paralysis and burn.
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I don't think Snover deserves to be nominated, if memory servers me right it didn't stay in the tier long enough for it to make any kind of impact. Yeah there was a suspect test for Snow Warning, but by the time it was over (and not banned for some reason) Snover was in RU.
Honestly I think guys like Swellow, Braviary, and Cryogonal are more deserving for nominations then Snover.
Honestly I think guys like Swellow, Braviary, and Cryogonal are more deserving for nominations then Snover.
It defined a dominant playstyle in two separate stages, and it would have been even better had it not been banned in UU / moved up to RU, respectively. I agree that it shouldn't make the top 10, but it's firmly an "honorable mention" and deserves a writeup.
OK guys, since everyone's lazy and won't do Snover and Cryogonal, and skylight's REALLY DUMB and refuses to update Musharna, we're going ahead with the voting now. Snover and Cryogonal aren't being included, but Musharna is. including snover and cryo by request
Jynx / Golurk / Scolipede / Alomomola / Sawk / Amoonguss / Ludicolo / Emboar / Absol / Magmortar / Samurott / Cinccino / Zangoose / Mesprit / Musharna / Snover / Cryogonal
these are your options, simply create a list of the Pokemon you think have been the most influential. I will be closing the voting in 2 weeks, perhaps a little more. remember, the list is in no particular order, but you may number them if you want. just know that the order you put them in won't make a difference; they just need to be there. a point is given to a pokemon for every time it shows up on a voting ballot. simply type the pokemon up one by one in a separate line. now, have fun and get voting!
if you want, you can include less than ten,but please try to put more than 5 at least :/
k getting rid of this rule post however many u want, just not over 10 ofc
Jynx / Golurk / Scolipede / Alomomola / Sawk / Amoonguss / Ludicolo / Emboar / Absol / Magmortar / Samurott / Cinccino / Zangoose / Mesprit / Musharna / Snover / Cryogonal
these are your options, simply create a list of the Pokemon you think have been the most influential. I will be closing the voting in 2 weeks, perhaps a little more. remember, the list is in no particular order, but you may number them if you want. just know that the order you put them in won't make a difference; they just need to be there. a point is given to a pokemon for every time it shows up on a voting ballot. simply type the pokemon up one by one in a separate line. now, have fun and get voting!
if you want, you can include less than ten,
k getting rid of this rule post however many u want, just not over 10 ofc
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Fusxfaranto
gonna smoke five blunts and watch anime
Jynx
Musharna
Sawk
Golurk
Emboar
Samurott
Cinccino
Magmortar
Musharna
Sawk
Golurk
Emboar
Samurott
Cinccino
Magmortar
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Jynx
Amoonguss
Musharna
Scolipede
Sawk
Samurott
Cincinno
Absol
Magmortar
Amoonguss
Musharna
Scolipede
Sawk
Samurott
Cincinno
Absol
Magmortar
Magmortar
Jynx
Sawk
Scolipede
Camerupt
I was going to put down stuff like Musharna/Absol/Emboar, but then I thought about it and in the metagames they were/are in, they were never truly dominant.
Jynx gets in because it's the focal point of two separate metagames. Sawk was the best Fighting-type in basically every single metagame by far. Magmortar was hands down the best wall-breaker the tier had ever seen. Scolipede dropped back down to NU and almost single-handedly brought back Spikes offense with it.
edit: ordered for funsies
Jynx
Sawk
Scolipede
I was going to put down stuff like Musharna/Absol/Emboar, but then I thought about it and in the metagames they were/are in, they were never truly dominant.
Jynx gets in because it's the focal point of two separate metagames. Sawk was the best Fighting-type in basically every single metagame by far. Magmortar was hands down the best wall-breaker the tier had ever seen. Scolipede dropped back down to NU and almost single-handedly brought back Spikes offense with it.
edit: ordered for funsies
Last edited:
Jynx
Magmortar
Musharna
Sawk
Cinccino
Amoonguss
Absol
Emboar
Alomomola
Scolipede
I thought that the regenerator core when it came out was very very strong with the combo of sleep and big wishes, so I felt that both pokes deserved somewhere on my top 10 list.
Magmortar
Musharna
Sawk
Cinccino
Amoonguss
Absol
Emboar
Alomomola
Scolipede
I thought that the regenerator core when it came out was very very strong with the combo of sleep and big wishes, so I felt that both pokes deserved somewhere on my top 10 list.
Jynx - Who can argue with that movepool?
Golurk - SR + No Guard Dynamicpunch started the lead war
Scolipede - Fast Spikes and strong Bug move
Sawk - BERT SMASH
Amoonguss - Why won't you die
Emboar - Dem STABs
Magmortar - Dem wallbreaking
Cinccino - It made Rocky Helmet worth a look at
Musharna - Why won't you die 2.0
Snover - Did things like stunt Musharna & boost Duosion, and ofc BlizzSpam
Golurk - SR + No Guard Dynamicpunch started the lead war
Scolipede - Fast Spikes and strong Bug move
Sawk - BERT SMASH
Amoonguss - Why won't you die
Emboar - Dem STABs
Magmortar - Dem wallbreaking
Cinccino - It made Rocky Helmet worth a look at
Musharna - Why won't you die 2.0
Snover - Did things like stunt Musharna & boost Duosion, and ofc BlizzSpam
In no particular order
Snover
Scolipede
Jynx
Musharna
Magmortar
Cinccino
Alomomola
Sawk
Amoonguss
Golurk
Snover
Scolipede
Jynx
Musharna
Magmortar
Cinccino
Alomomola
Sawk
Amoonguss
Golurk