~Introduction~
Hello Smogon! I'm Smith, and if you do know me, it's probably as a rater of teams here- if you don't, swell, what's up. With 4th gen slipping through my fingers, symbolized by now allowing 5th generation teams into the RMT forum, I couldn't think of a better time to post this team. I do periodically post teams here for you to rate as well, but not very often, because very rarely do I stumble upon a team that meets my ever-increasing standards. So hopefully that speaks for the team you are about to encounter- I absolutely love this team to pieces, for various reasons, and it is my finest and final creation in a metagame I love. But let me give you a back story.Before making this team, I had been using a lot of stall. I wasn't that good at stall all of the time. I have a tendency to just play on autopilot half the time, and the long term thinking that stall possesses often made me screw myself in tournaments, watching in horror as I got 6-0'd, more than once in important tourneys. I disliked how little innovation you could really bring to heavy stall, and I decided to get rid of that. I wanted a team to cater to my playing style, one that fit me like a glove, one that I could whip out and inflict some damage with. I suppose this means I'll have to describe to you my playing style, and it works a little something like this. Like I said, I like to think as little as possible. Removing counters so a late-game sweeper could go nuts isn't always my style, but neither is preserving a stall core and systematically staying ahead of the enemy. I like defensive play, but I like some offensive play too. The 'mons need to be bulky, but they need to be able to do something too. I like entry hazards, but usually don't like using all three since they're so hard to keep intact. I like being innovative and using cool new sets, because they take little skill to use since I catch everyone off guard. In short, somewhere in between semi-stall and bulky offense is where I usually find myself.
But this team isn't bulky offense, and it isn't stall either. When I really think about, it employs no specific win condition at all- hardly any dedicated sweepers, but no powerful abuse of entry hazards. And I think that's what I like about it. It focuses on nobody in particular, and no 'mon is more important than the other. I can take things slow or I can take things fast, and either way it works. I kill the enemy one at a time, no strategy in mind, no hidden sweeper in the background. I play the cards as I get them, and through simply playing smartly, taking chances only if need arise, I can get the win. The team works because it emphasizes SYNERGY. I have stumbled, mostly by chance with this team on several very, very potent combinations of Pokemon, and I can just switch around all day. The team, of course, has problems, but none insurmountable, and really provided I play right, nothing should sweep me outright. Everything has a purpose, and, by using strange sets, more often than not the opponent doesn't always know how to react. The Pokemon on this team are easy to use- they don't require counters be removed, since they aren't sweeping that frequently, and there's not much of a long term way to play the team. In short, it works in a way mysteriously effective, and I'm not about to change it. I hope you like this team.
The title is based on this video, which makes me laugh, and it sounds badass. No other reasons. The nicknames are songs I like.
~Team Building Process- from Humble Beginnings~
So, I commited a sin and started with my lead. I wanted to use ENZ0's mixed Tyranitar lead, and he's sometimes hard to just jam onto a team half-way through, due to his unique typing and ability. I had used him on an offensive team like ENZ0's, which sucked for some reason. I then thought that the best way to use him would be as a lead, as I remembered the Team of Torment or Il Colpo del Guerriero Invisibile. So I thought, what Pokemon could cover some of his more nasty weaknesses and synergize with him to form an effective defensive core?
Okay, so on the type chart it's not that impressive, but in terms of actual concrete examples they work fantastically together. This establishes my spike-stacking core, which works famously in the early-game to get up my hazards. The only two weaknesses I didn't have covered were Electric and Fighting, and there was no use putting off the spin blocker, since I had some considerable hazards. I chose to invent my own set, which I am very proud of and works famously on this team (but in due time, in due time). Obviously it had to be Rotom-A.
Water types were still something of a problem, as well as Infernape, and obviously I was going to need a bulky water, right? I added Vapoureon, to use Roar and shuffle around the opposition as well as fill in some synergy gaps.
At this point the synergy looked pretty good, and really I could have gone any way with the team. However, Grass and Electric were somewhat compelling weaknesses and, having recently been exposed to team DINOSAURS, I wanted to try out Venusaur to see if he was any good. He also helped a minour issue with SD Lucario.
The main body of the team really had already come together, and now all I was looking for was a revenge killer to patch it all up. I wanted one that resisted rock, which currently was unresisted on the team, and it went between Jirachi and Flygon- however, Jirachi gave me 3 fire weaknesses, which I didn't like, and Flygon was immune to the ever present thunder waves, so I decided to go with him.
Completed? Not quite. I found Vaporeon lacking in his department, as he invited too many threats to come in and just let the pressure drop. A lack of offensive power meant that the team was currently rather lackluster. I decided to replace him with a bulky CM Suicune, which brings us to the team I have today.
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~Supersonique Electronique~
Tyranitar "A-Punk" @ Lum Berry
204 Atk / 208 Spe / 96 SpAtk
Lonely (+Atk, -Def)
-Stealth Rock
-Crunch
-Superpower
-Fire Blast
Wow, what a damn cool lead. A slight variation on ENZ0's lead Tyranitar from Team Fireflies always starts me off on the right foot. With the sudden decrease of Machamp leads, there has never been a better time to use this bro. Not everybody really knows how to react to this guy, because he has so many options. I frequently face the dilemma of wanting to use Tyranitar to stop some threats of some sort, but not wanting to use any particular set- I don't want CB, or CS, or Cursetar or whatever. With this, he has no restricting item and can just be Tyranitar- with a surprise.
I suppose I should explain the moveslot. The first two shouldn't shock you- Stealth Rock is for Stealth Rock, Crunch is for awesome dark-type STAB. But Superpower and Fire Blast might seem a little fishy. IN all honestly, this guy is one of the best stall breakers. Ever. Firstly, Crunch and Superpower are unresisted by anything save Toxicroak and Heracross, which is legit, and secondly, this guy tears up SkarmBliss and, by association, SkarmBlissTom or ForrBlissTom. Meaning, stall teams have a problem. Fire Blast also has some other uses- if I'm feeling gutsy in the early game, for example, I've murdered many a shocked Scizor through a scorching fire blast in the face, using U turn to scout my switch in.
The EVs are a bit strange as well, so I'll explain those. As opposed to no investment, his speed allows him to outspeed 0 EVS Gyarados, Skarmory and Scizor, as well as RestTalk Rotom-A and AgilityGross before the speed boost. Nothing much above that is worth anything, except maybe Magnezone but w/e, not really worth it. The special attack, as opposed to no investment, is enough to 2HKO most Skarmory leads and Metagross leads, as well as OHKO Forry before stealth rock. The rest is dumped into attack to power up my main moves, with defense lowered since I need the offensive stats and his special defense is one of his selling points.
His usefulness is not limited to the early-game- I find myself using him to stop Zapdos, Azelf, Rotom-A, and Heatran for most of the match, as well as he can without recovery anyway. I suppose I could feasibly put in Rest somewhere, but I can't imagine over what. Anyways, as a lead, he matches up well, here are the match-ups.
Skarmory "Spiralling" @ Leftovers
252 HP / 240 SpDef / 16 Spe
Careful (+SpDef, -SpArk)
-Spikes
-Whirlwind
-Roost
-Brave Bird
Skarmory is an awesome Pokemon for this team, and probably the single most important Pokemon. Because the team isn't exactly a "sweeping" team and revolves around defensive synergy, spikes are my biggest asset and allow me to apply a lot more pressure and damage on the opposition. In addition to this, Tyranitar's counters are almost entirely beat or handled by Skarmory, which make Tyraniskarm (?) an excellent spikes stacking combo. Synergy wise, Skarmory plays some extremely vital roles. In addition to being my all-important spiker, he is my only pseudo-Hazer to keep set up sweepers from going crazy as well as my only steel type. Basically, Skarmory is useful from the first few moves to the endgame.
The obvious question when picking out Skarmory or Forretress is, why aren't you using the other? Well, Forretress has some handy options, but I didn't need any for this team. Rapid Spin wasn't necessary as hazards aren't a huge issue for the team, and Venusaur can suck up toxic spikes. Speaking of, I don't personally like using them, seeing as how you need to get up 2 layers or you're just wasting time, or the fact that they can be absorbed for no reason. I find spreading toxic by hand better if I need it. Skarmory won it for me thanks to actually having RECOVERY, as well as being the phazer so crucial to this team. Forretress just isn't for this team. I could use Roserade, but she would have to go in over Venusaur who is so much better than Roserade in every capacity (but in good time).
As far as the set goes, it's pretty standard. Special Defensive Skarmory is a much better choice in almost every scenario, in my opinion. Skarmory already has plenty of defense, such that it hardly makes a difference. Packing some special defense gives me a much, much better solution to some otherwise troublesome Pokemon like Shaymin, Gengar and Dragonite. Overall the pros outweigh the cons. Moveset is also pretty normal, BB> taunt or toxic or whatever because otherwise Machamp is really annoying and having some surprisingly powerful STAB never killed anyone (just fainted them, bu dum KSH). Overall Skarmory is very important to the success of the team.
Suicune "Starlight" @Leftovers
236 HP / 44 SpAtk / 228 Spe
Timid (+Spe -Atk)
-Calm Mind
-Hydro Pump
-Ice Beam
-Hidden Power Electric / Roar
Suicune is a damn cool Pokemon as always, and does many things for this team. Like I said, Vaporeon used to be here but I much prefer Suicune for being the team's only "sweeper". Suicune, in essence, is the team's bulky water, a role so important in today's metagame, and a great sweeper with some spikes on the ground. He combines great bulk with diverse attacking prowess, and is very difficult for a lot of teams to stop if I get him going.
If you're wondering about the set, I stole this from Viva la Vida and haven't had any complaints. Speed tying with other Suicune or max speed roserade or something isn't going to do anything for me, so the speed is enough to outdo Lucario, Mamoswine, and everything below. The HP would be maxed, but having a leftover number is nice and the small special attack is all that's left. This provides me with a good Infernape or Heatran or whatever counter; I seriously don't need Suicune dying to these pussies and having them sweep the team. I've gone back and forth on using HP Electric or Roar- Roar works amazing with spikes support, but I can't stand taunt Gyarados without HP Electric and he becomes a REAL ASSHOLE to the rest of the team- I prefer to stop him before he starts. However I really use both depending on the situation, whether it's tournament or ladder play, etc. Both are obviously very useful.
I did mention that I replaced Vaporeon for this bro, and you may ask why. While my team was lacking in the offensive department, that wasn't really the main reason. Vaporeon, thanks to wish recovery and whatnot, often requires a lot of moveslots just to keep it alive and functioning at an appropriate level- wish + protect is mandatory so that he doesn't get worn down, and surf is required. So I basically only had one slot left with which to work. Suicune, since he isn't set up on easily, doesn't require any of that, and he's loads bulkier on the physical side. Vaporeon plays more of a passive role in keeping fire types and water types from sweeping me, and I guess I wanted something that could actually do something besides just walling them all day. With some defensive investment, he still functions well and keeps my momentum without having to rely on roar or something to cover the diverse amount of things that Suicune covers. Suicune can handle dragons like Flygon and Dragonite a lot better as well, and since these guys are occasionally problematic I like having a good counter. In summary, Suicune does the jobs I need him to do and then some.
Venusaur "Boy" @ Leftovers
252 HP / 56 Spe / 24 SpAtk / 176 SpDef
Calm (+SpDef, -Atk)
-Sleep Powder
-Leech Seed
-Energy Ball
-Hidden Power (Fire)
Okay so I know what you're thinking. That's a Venusaur. He's UU. Take it easy, and let me assure you that he's my favourite Pokemon on the whole team. Venusaur is an absolute big fucking badass, and combines all of the good features of grass types today. Firstly, Venusaur is just bulky. Very, very bulky. I don't think I've ever seen him OHKO'd with something. That works just fantastic, because that allows him to use sleep powder. Venusaur is sort of a last-resort check to a lot of things, since he can tank a hit and put them to sleep. From there, Leech Seed + spikes support racks up damage from switches as he inevitably switches out sleeping beauty. The other two moves just give me some STAB moves. Grass/Poison typing distinguishes him from other grass types, and grants him a very important resistance to fighting types- without Venusaur, fighting types would be a royal pain for this team. He can put most to sleep or just hit them with w/e. It also enables him to absorb toxic spikes, which is ridiculously helpful.
The set is somewhat strange, but I'll try and outline it. Max HP is to keep up the bulk. 108 spe is more than the recently QC approved version of this set suggests, but it helps with so many things- namely, Crocune, Defensive Gyarados, Defensive Rotom, agility metagross, most scizor and even Abomasnow (that's way more important than you might think) are outsped. Hidden Power Fire helps me out SO MUCH against these things, and without it, SD Lucario becomes an absolute menace for this team to face- only Rotom outspeeds it. It also helps with Scizor, Metagross and again, the occasional Abomasnow. Energy Ball is the only other difference between the analysis and this, but it's for Rotom. The last thing I need is defensive Rotom or SubSplit or whatever setting up substitutes on Venusaur, and energy ball breaks that. It also stops Vaporeon and Lanturn from being absolute penises. The small special attack investment is for breaking Gengar's subs with HP.
It's almost impossible to discourse all of the things Venusaur does for the team, but he's just a damn good grass type to consider and the bulkiest of many, with the most advantageous typing. Basically, think of Roserade, give it bulk, take away spikes, take away natural cure, and you've got him. Really the lack of natural cure is the only complaint I have. Basically, Vensaur keeps me in the game thanks to unique properties, Sleep Powder, and the ever annoying Leech Seed + spikes combo. I love this 'mon, and please don't knock him until you've given him a go.
Flygon "Lazy Eye" @ Choice Scarf
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4SpDef
Jolly (+Spe, -SpAtk)
-Earthquake
-Outrage
-U Turn
-Toxic
Okay, Flygon, nothing too new here. Basically, thanks to some fantastic typing, ability and moveset, Flygon is just the best revenge killer in the metagame. Out of my three favourite scarfers- Rotom, Flygon, and Jirachi- Flygon just fits the best. Rotom has to double as my spin blocker, so I'm not so huge on having him as a scarfer, and Jirachi's typing just didn't work. Flygon works well thanks to a ground immunity, fire resistance and a very, very important electric immunity. Without Flygon, Jolteon and paralysis in general would all be very annoying. He's also the most durable of the scarfers- SR Resistance, spikes/t spikes immunity and SS immunity means that he stays alive longer than any other scarfer, even if he isn't always that bulky. He's also one of the fastest and, with spikes support, pretty powerful too. These traits often mean that he's the last Pokemon I'll have left at the end of the game, if I play him carefully, and he's Outrage/Earthquake swept the opposition in this position countless times. Since most dragon resists are grounded, Outrage is a great clean-up option.
The one odd thing you may notice is Toxic. Why, Smith, why would you even consider this as a choice? I'll tell you why- it's gotten me out of binds countless times. Flygon users often have trouble with the fourth slot- Fire Blast hits like a pussy and requires too much prediction; Stone Edge has shitty accuracy; Thunder Punch is basically only good for Gyarados. Toxic is just what this team needs. I'll go ahead and tell you that Zapdos is probably one of the biggest threats this team faces- he's too diverse, spikes don't hit him, nobody can really take his hits all that well except my lead, and he chugs dick. Well, using toxic gets him out of the way for most of the battle, and I know he can't stall me forever anymore. Toxic, basically, is how I "revenge" annoying, bulky Pokemon. If I just can't stop Vaporeon, if CM Suicune is on a rampage, if my opponent is pissing me off with Stockpile Cradily, Toxic is just a great way to go. It's so diverse and hits so many things in at least some way, that it fits perfectly into the traditional "4th moveslot" position.
Some people may wonder why I use Jolly nature, and the answer is that it's worth it. Yeah, I know that Salamence isn't around to tie with anymore, but SubPetaya Empoleon, Agility Metagross and opposing Flygon/Jirachis more than make up for the increase in power. Spikes really help cover the difference anyway. The surplus point is dropped into special defense so that Porygon-z gets an attack boost instead of a special attack boost. In summary, it's a miracle I could even pound out a description this long about him (yo thanks toxic) because we all know what he does and he does it well.
Rotom-w "How Soon is Now?" @ Leftovers
252 HP / 188 Spe / 68 SpDef
Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
-Thunderbolt
-Hydro Pump
-Substitute
-Toxic
And we finish the team with a rather interesting member. Rotom-w is mine and everybody else's spin blocker, so no surprise there. The only strange part is really the set, which I'll try to explain here. Substitute + Toxic is a really cool combination for taking down a myriad of bulky Pokemon, like bulky waters and Hippowdon and the like. Rotom has a knack for forcing switches, accumulating spikes damage, which gets me a substitute, and from there I can toxic a wall coming in to absorb a thunderbolt or something, or hit the steel types immune to it with either a hydro pump or thunderbolt that actually does some good damage after spikes and two hits- remember, most steel types are either weak to the two moves (Skarmory, Heatran) or at least 2HKO'd after spikes and stealth rock. Substitute also gives me some breathing room against common pursuiters trying to get rid of my spin blocker. I guess more than anything it's great just having a durable member of the team with Toxic, and because of this trait, Rotom-w is a great stop to most of the metagame's most threatening water types.
The EVs are pretty basic. 188 + Timid is to get the jump on Adamant Lucario, who I really hate- Jolly Lucario is a big threat to the team. Otherwise, Max HP is obvious on such a defensive Pokemon and the rest is dumped into special defense because, again, his main job is stopping bulky waters. Like most spike teams I really hate Starmie so the special bulk helps in making sure he doesn't eat my lunch. The lack of Shadow Ball may surprise you, but what's it useful for? Gengar outspeeds it, other Rotom are faster, and Azelf/Uxie/Alakazam or something aren't like Rotom scenarios. Hydro Pump is just as powerful as Shadow Ball + STAB and gets me great neutral coverage, hitting annoying Heatran and Tyranitar for example.
The one problem this set does have is Grass types, but fortunately the rest of my team handles these like a champ- ironically, Breloom counters this set 100% but thankfully Venusaur kicks ass. The other iffy thing about him is the lack of recovery + SS weakness + Substitute. Thankfull Rotom-w's pretty durable, but I can't stop thinking of the times I wish I didn't have SS tormenting this poor guy- and anyway I can't think where I'd put Pain Split. Overall however Rotom-w keeps me ahead against most common spinners, does wonders for the team synergy and is a great way to run Rotom if you want to catch your opponent off guard as well as the ever-annoying Starmie.
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~Threats List~
Order based on the grotesquely outdated August Statistics
~Shout-outs~
Cost/ENZ0/apologies/Phillip7086: Your teams were all very very influential for me at the time of making this thread, just flip through them and I'm sure you'll see some major elements of your teams. Thanks for sharing them!Faladran (Jirachi): Great freakin' rater right here, I remember when he started *sniff*. It's pretty cool that we live about an hour from each other, WE SHOULD HANG (??? am I kidding???). Anyways he's probably one of the most consistent people here, good job.
undisputed: Another good rater, it's a miracle he was this good of a user and didn't have a badge of SOME kind (until recently). As I'm sure you know, Whispers in the Dark is one of my favourite teams and was also an influence in making this team.
Plus: Isn't exactly around anymore, but was my tutor and definitely shoved me in the right direction- without him, I wouldn't be half the user I am today.
RMT staff: Mods and those working down at the RMT basics forum, thank you for putting up with me when I was a noob, looking through my practice rates, and keeping my favourite sub-forum running smoothly.
Team Raters still badgless: Some guys I don't know as well, but people like Aerrow, The LegendKiller, Heist and Scimjara are all fantastic raters here. I appreciate you other RMT regulars, I can see you all getting the badge some day.
If you feel like you ought to belong on here, please message me, IT WON'T BE AWKWARD I PROMISE
~Final Words~
And finally my monster thread comes to an end. I love this team to the end and it works awesomely for me. It saddens me to think that 4th gen is leaving, since all my life it is the only competitive generation I've played, but I suppose all good things... yeah cliches. Seriously, the first time I ever logged onto shoddy, everybody in the chat was discussing the RECENT Garchomp ban. I guess it's weird to think about starting over. Learning how to play 5th generation is going to take some time getting used to, but I'm confident it'll work out okay. Feel free to hate/steal/rate and post anything you want. I may have some minour errors in the thread, despite having read through it a couple times over, so please excuse me. If you just have some questions about the team, want to tweak a set, refine some EVs, or just say that you like it and you gave it a luvdisc (yeaahhh) please feel free to post, I'll address all of your comments and they all mean something to me.
~Changes Log~
I won't be editing the original draft of the team unless I get some major changes, so just check here.-Suicune EV spread has been altered to Max HP, taken out of special attack
-Venusaur EV spread has been altered to only 56 Spe EVs, the excess dumped into special defense
-Skarmory's nature has been changed to Impish over Careful
-On the occasion that I use Roar on Suicune, Flygon's toxic has been changed to thunderpunch
-Considered: Earthquake > Superpower on Tyranitar; bulkier EV spread
-Considered: Stone Edge > Thunderpunch or Toxic on Flygon
-Considered: "Switching" Flygon and Rotom's sets.
~finis
