ORAS OU Stall from a HO player!

[dsm77773]

Hi, I'm dsm77773. Welcome to my first ORAS OU RMT.

"Wait, what? A stall team? But you're an offensive player!". Don't worry guys, I didn't convert to the terribad stall religion.
So then, why a stall team? Well, one of my biggest flaws as a player is stall. I'm uncapable of building any decent stall team nor play with it. That makes me predictable, I'll be always bringing up somewhat offensive teams. So this, for me, is a challenge. I was encouraged by this article from The Smog (issue 39), extremely helpful! You should read it first to understand better all the RMT.
I decided to build a fairly standard Mega Sableye stall team. And... it wasn't consistent. It just proved why stall is bad after the new shift to offense.
That's why I ask for help here.

I'm not writing the teambuilding process as it can be easily seen and understood in the link I posted above. Now...

The team at a glance

In depth
Teamslot 1: Mega Sableye

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Dark Pulse
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
The Mega and star of the team: Mega Sableye. Magic Bounce is arguably one of the better abilities in the game, even better for stall. However, you'll always find yourself delaying the Mega Evolution to keep a Prankster Will-O-Wisp. Most of the time I just have a FEELING that I'll need it.
I always try to counter-lead when picking one to start a match, however, after the ladder reset, I'm stuck in the horrible and misterious low ladder, so I end up picking Sableye to get an early burn and try to bounce hazards.
When I was building this, at the start I was running the utility set, but at the end of the teambuilding I found myself without a wincon, so I changed it to the Calm Mind set. Dark Pulse is over Shadow Ball because I absolutely hate not being able to literally touch Normal-types, even though I do technically have Will-O-Wisp.
Calm Mind provides me with a wincon, but let's be realistic. Mega Sableye almost never gets to bounce hazards (although I can deal with that) nor use Calm Mind, let alone sweeping. On most battles you only click Recover or Will-O-Miss. Mega Sableye's bulk is also very underwhelming, but enough to get going. Also having a Pokémon in the back ready to come in and bounce status moves really affects my opponent's plays (not really, I said I'm on the low ladder).

Teamslot 2: The Entry Hazard Remover

Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
Ability: Liquid Ooze
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 28 SpD / 16 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Rapid Spin
- Acid Spray
- Haze
Let's be honest here. While Tentacruel has very good synergy with Mega Sableye, Tentacruel is by far the worst member of the team. The main problem I'm having with it is it's lack of recovery. Ok, I have TWO Wish passers on the team, but Tentacruel usually gets OHKOed on the switch. Tentacruel takes a lot of damage taking on Pokémon so it can't always spin. And if Tentacruel falls, this leaves me open to some threats to dismantle the whole build, for example, any entry hazard setter that can beat Mega Sableye one-on-one. Hazard stack suddenly becames more threatening.
On the set, standard stuff. Rapid Spin aids Mega Sableye in taking out the hazards it cannot always bounce. Haze is over more common options such as Toxic Spikes (which I thought detrimental to the team's wide array of statuses to spread) and Knock Off to not automatically lose to set-up if Clefable falls. Notably, it allows Tentacruel to stop Belly Drum Azumarill cold (switching while it sets up) which is nice.

Teamslot 3: The Super Wall

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Aromatherapy
Astronomical bulk and not fearing status? Yes, please!
For some reason, Chansey is in every RMT I've made (4 at the moment: 2 BH ones, in a meta where Imposter Chansey is everywhere; a RBY OU one where Chansey is on most teams too, and this one).
Chansey walls so much is not even funny, taking pathetic damage from almost everything. My super wall is meant to spread poison (easily abused by my two Protects) and clerical support, which Mega Sableye absolutely adores, Tentacruel too to a lesser extent. Standard set, not much to say here. It can't touch Ghost-types, especially Gengar, but Mega Sableye takes care of those via Dark Pulse.

Teamslot 4: The Fairy Killer

Jirachi @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Wish
- Protect
The infamous paraflincher is back, supporting Mega Sableye by getting rid of its only natural weakness. Iron Head is STAB to hit Fairies hard and packs a good chance to hax to death anything slower (and forcing a lot of ragequits). Body Slam is here for paralyzing even Ground-types. Go for it when you force a switch because its basically a free 60% chance to complete the paraflinch combo and hax the switch in. Wish and Protect are self-explanatory.
My team is slow, so it might have to take a potentially fatal hit to recover. This is when Wish passing helps, giving you "fast" recovery to an otherwise too weakened wall to keep on taking on Pokémon. Tentacruel has no recovery at all (just Black Sludge) so it is the one that enjoys Wishes the most.

Teamslot 5: The Secondary Physical Wall

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Stone Edge
I'd hate losing to Mega Charizard X and I didn't like Slowbro, and I had an Unaware wall already so I thought I didn't need Swagsire. Teamslot 5 is the most flexible one, and I ended up giving it to standard Hippo. It basically deals with physical threats Mega Sableye can't. Sand Stream also allows it to rack up a lot of passive damage while not hindering its teammates that much. I have enough status flying around to use Toxic on the last moveslot. Stone Edge goes on its place to take out Flying-types and Air Ballon pokes. I'm still an offensive player and while this is a stall team I still like to play aggressively. Hippowdon is also my hazard setter, on predicted switches place Stealth Rock.

Teamslot 6: The Mega Sableye Counter

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower
- Wish
- Protect
A Mega Sableye stall team is ironic on its own. It is very weak to Mega Sableye so the last teamslot is dedicated to its counter. Clefable not only counters Mega Sableye but also brings a lot of utility in checking set-up sweepers and Wish passing. Flamethrower is over Heal Bell because I already have a cleric, and it gets rid of those pesky Steel-types that think they can do a number to you. Still you won't be able to deal one-on-one with them, but a Flamethrower will hurt while you switch out.

Conclusion and final spoilers
It's not been a consistent team, but I had decent success with it, so it's my first step at mastering stall too!

Shoutouts

my friends michaeloche thdhted jordanthejq12 Joshz thdhted I haven't forgot your challenge
Chopin Alkaninoff Piccolo Daimao Ransei Voltages Pikachuun and basically everybody on the Other Metas room the OU room can just wish to be like us
(sorry if I missed somebody, pls PM me and I'll add you ASAP)

Threatlist

Manaphy. If its Rain Dance + Tail Glow... forfeit.

Hoopa-U. I haven't faced one yet, but this is stall, so you don't stand a chance against it.

Diggersby. Azumarill is a cuter rabbit. Now seriously, this thing is free to Swords Dance and proceed to 2HKO the whole team, even Clefable. When you face one don't Mega Evolve Sableye and try to burn it at all costs.

Shitty gimmicks. I hate losing to them, but I'm on the low ladder stuck, and some of them can catch me off-guard and screw me over.

oops I'm missing the importable

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Dark Pulse
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp

Tentacruel @ Black Sludge
Ability: Liquid Ooze
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Def / 28 SpD / 16 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Rapid Spin
- Acid Spray
- Haze

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD
Bold Nature
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Aromatherapy

Jirachi @ Leftovers
EVs: 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Body Slam
- Wish
- Protect

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Slack Off
- Stone Edge

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Flamethrower
- Wish
- Protect

 

[-Lone]

Hi there, solid team that can be improved in few passages. Snarl > Dark Pulse can help you against other calm mind abusers, if you dont like the low base Power use shadow ball. Ghost stab is preferred for its best neutral coverage and also because normal types cant really touch you. Then you really, really need a ground immunity. Lando-t or diggersby can easily set-up a sword dance and then proceed to sweep your whole team (clefable is 2hkoed by their stab). For this reason i suggest you to put Skarmory > Tentacruel keeping the hazards remover thanks to defog. The next change is the chansey spread, EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD this allow you to take physical hits better without losing much on the special side. Even though hippowdon is a great physical wall i think you should change it with Quagsire. +2 Bisharp only needs an iron head flinch on hippo to totally smack your team and also bulk up Talonflame and SD Gliscor can set-up and beat your team. Last id change flamethrower with Calm mind. This give you a second reliable win condition and at the same time a way to deal with rain dance rest manaphy.

Hide

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Defog
- Stealth Rock
- Whirlwind

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Earthquake
- Toxic

 

[Sablenite]

dsm77773, welcome to the play style of stall.

Sableye

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Calm Mind

These changes come in handy because, as you said, timing is everything in mega evolving Sableye, an odd HP lets it switch-in to stealth rocks more, and Shadow Ball hits for more damage on quite a bit of things, and its not going to kill a Chansey anyhow (and Curselax is almost non-existent.)

Chansey

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 12 HP / 248 Def / 248 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell

These changes are made for simple reasons, first addressing the EVs: Eviolite is a 1.5 boost rounding down two the nearest whole, so the 8 lost points are now invested in HP. Seismic Toss does fixed damage, so 0 Atk IVs minimize the Foul Play / Confusion HAX damage. Heal Bell over Aromatherapy because Wish is incompatible with Aromatherapy, and bluffing a Wish from this is a horrifying idea for your opponent and reduces the switches they will make.

Hippowdon and Jirachi are good, just move 4 HP to SpD for a Stealth Rock number.
I'll add something if I think of something that will work better. (I use SpD Mold Breaker Excadrill on most of my teams needing a fairy answer and spinner, which can Toxic opposing Sableyes.)

 

[Josh]

I don't know why I didn't get a notification, but thanks for the shoutout!
Stall saks
Always drop 4 in SpD over HP, not only for the Stealth Rock number but also because boosting porygon's atk rather than spa is occasionally useful and hey, it's not like def makes a difference!

I was going to suggest Skarmory > Tentacruel as well before I saw -Lone 's post, it really helps your team a lot. Tentacruel is pretty terrible anyways, and Skarmory has great defensive synergy with this team as well as having recovery/hazard control.

Nice team!

 

[dsm77773]

Updated descriptions and the threatlist.

Hi there, solid team that can be improved in few passages. Snarl > Dark Pulse can help you against other calm mind abusers, if you dont like the low base Power use shadow ball. Ghost stab is preferred for its best neutral coverage and also because normal types cant really touch you. Then you really, really need a ground immunity. Lando-t or diggersby can easily set-up a sword dance and then proceed to sweep your whole team (clefable is 2hkoed by their stab). For this reason i suggest you to put Skarmory > Tentacruel keeping the hazards remover thanks to defog. The next change is the chansey spread, EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD this allow you to take physical hits better without losing much on the special side. Even though hippowdon is a great physical wall i think you should change it with Quagsire. +2 Bisharp only needs an iron head flinch on hippo to totally smack your team and also bulk up Talonflame and SD Gliscor can set-up and beat your team. Last id change flamethrower with Calm mind. This give you a second reliable win condition and at the same time a way to deal with rain dance rest manaphy.

Hide

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Defog
- Stealth Rock
- Whirlwind

Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Scald
- Recover
- Earthquake
- Toxic

The general opinion is Skarmory over Tentacruel so I'll definitely test that! Not too sure on Swagsire but I'll try it too.
Snarl seems good so I'll make the change and see how it goes.
On Calm Mind on Clefable, I hate removing Flamethrower but Mega Sableye is an unreliable wincon so again I'll test it.
Thx for the rate!

dsm77773, welcome to the play style of stall.

Sableye

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Calm Mind

These changes come in handy because, as you said, timing is everything in mega evolving Sableye, an odd HP lets it switch-in to stealth rocks more, and Shadow Ball hits for more damage on quite a bit of things, and its not going to kill a Chansey anyhow (and Curselax is almost non-existent.)

Chansey

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 12 HP / 248 Def / 248 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seismic Toss
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Heal Bell

These changes are made for simple reasons, first addressing the EVs: Eviolite is a 1.5 boost rounding down two the nearest whole, so the 8 lost points are now invested in HP. Seismic Toss does fixed damage, so 0 Atk IVs minimize the Foul Play / Confusion HAX damage. Heal Bell over Aromatherapy because Wish is incompatible with Aromatherapy, and bluffing a Wish from this is a horrifying idea for your opponent and reduces the switches they will make.

Hippowdon and Jirachi are good, just move 4 HP to SpD for a Stealth Rock number.
I'll add something if I think of something that will work better. (I use SpD Mold Breaker Excadrill on most of my teams needing a fairy answer and spinner, which can Toxic opposing Sableyes.)

Agree on the EVs spreads, will decide Snarl or Shadow Ball after testing. On Heal Bell there's 0 reason not to do the change, Aromatherapy is cooler, but any small improving makes the team better. Thank you too for optimizing the team!

I don't know why I didn't get a notification, but thanks for the shoutout!
Stall saks
Always drop 4 in SpD over HP, not only for the Stealth Rock number but also because boosting porygon's atk rather than spa is occasionally useful and hey, it's not like def makes a difference!

I was going to suggest Skarmory > Tentacruel as well before I saw -Lone 's post, it really helps your team a lot. Tentacruel is pretty terrible anyways, and Skarmory has great defensive synergy with this team as well as having recovery/hazard control.

Nice team!

You're welcome man! Weird that you didn't get the notification but w/e.
Agree with Tentacruel being horrible, I'll do the change, thank you for the help!

 

[FlamingVictini]

Hey there,
I'm low on time so this won't be lengthy but there are a few things you can fix with your team to make it perform better. I'll quickly just highlight the major change and then leave an importable of the full edited team for you to use.

Tentacruel has been lackluster for you, and i also find that the listed "fairy answers" aren't really common stall members that I see. I recommend SDef skarmory > Tenta as it avoids the 2hko from focus blast, allowing you to roost it off and stall out the gard. You also have iron head to hit it back. You will only really lose to gard from a WoW set which chansey full counters, or if it outplays you with taunt very well.

With this change you become much weaker to water attacks, while jirachi is kind of redundant. Amoonguss > Jirachi is good to handle such attacks while also additionally soft checking most fairy types (especially azumarill, although watch out for belly drum now) as well.

Finally, to avoid changing your team too much into a very standard stall team, a simple clefable spread change will allow you to better handle TG + RD manaphy. You NEED Unaware Wish/Tect/Heal Bell if you want to be able to beat TG + RD Manaphy, which is the most troublesome manaphy set to stall. I will, however, recommend heal bell > flamethrower since you need it on clef itself to better handle scald burns to beat manaphy, giving you room to run Stealth Rock > Aromatherapy on Chansey. The reason i suggest this is because your team is very weak to Zard-Y, Taunt Heatran, and Taunt Gengar, which is remedied by running a fully specially defensive hippowdon. You can also make it physically bulky and a potent win con with Curse > Stealth Rock.

Since these changes make your natural physical bulk a bit less, and also considering that you now have a win con in hippowdon, I think you should reconsider a Utility MSab > CM. With Foul Play the opponent has much less breathing room with Zard-X and Bisharp, while you also have good utility with Knock Off (alternatively, fake out gives you a guaranteed mega to stop hazards alongside skarm while also dealing a little chip damage thats useful for stalling the opponent).

New Team

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Foul Play
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp

Skarmory @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Iron Head
- Roost
- Defog
- Whirlwind

Chansey @ Eviolite
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 8 HP / 252 Def / 248 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic
- Soft-Boiled
- Seismic Toss
- Stealth Rock

Amoonguss @ Black Sludge
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 68 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Clear Smog
- Spore

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Curse
- Slack Off
- Stone Edge

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Heal Bell
- Wish
- Protect

Let me know how the changes work out, good luck with the team! :D

 

[OGBattler]

Hey just from a very quick glance, One problem I see is you have two wishers and you got CM sableye assuming its your ''win condition''. A simple fix too all this is 1. Change your Sableye to regular M sableye. Ie,

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Foul Play / Fake Out / Toxic
- Knock Off
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp

Reasoning, is you will be switching in your sableye a lot playing mega sableye stall, too take advantage of magic bounce so because of this you take lots of unnecessary damage, making it personally hard for you too set up. Also CM sableye imo isn't much of a win condition. Switching your clefable too this >

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Flamethrower

OR if from your experience you struggle with set up sweepers/playing around such threats then you can even go UNAWARE CALM MIND!.

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Flamethrower

Your keeping nearly same moveset has your current Clefable, Just instead your having calm mind and making clefable a solid win con, especially in stall teams. Like I mention above it's unnecessary too carry two wish passers when all your pokemon have basic recovery moves minus tentacruel.