SP Shared Power

[KaenSoul]

​

You guys may be surprised because after some discussion with OM staff, we have decided to bring back ability restrictions to Shared Power.
You can see in the post linked above why these were removed back in Gen 7, but since then SP has changed a lot, the premise is different now and the generational changes we have experienced, as GF clearly focus on signature abilities when designing Pokémon now (like Gholdengo), and that resulted in the ban of many as a side effect (like the Past Paradoxes), and even beyond that there are multiple Pokémon that are now illegal to use because all their abilities are banned (like Sandslash), but by restricting some abilities to not be able to share we will now be able to reintroduce them to the tier, this will work similar to how STABmons handles moves, so some other previously banned abilities may also become legal again, but restricted to only the Pokémon that can use them in standard play.
The council will be discussing the abilities that will become restricted, so expect another announcement soon, in the meantime, answer this survey:
https://forms.gle/vKLHrn6kpoFk5Eba7

 

[Cuddly]

​

You guys may be surprised because after some discussion with OM staff, we have decided to bring back ability restrictions to Shared Power.
You can see in the post linked above why these were removed back in Gen 7, but since then SP has changed a lot, the premise is different now and the generational changes we have experienced, as GF clearly focus on signature abilities when designing Pokémon now (like Gholdengo), and that resulted in the ban of many as a side effect (like the Past Paradoxes), and even beyond that there are multiple Pokémon that are now illegal to use because all their abilities are banned (like Sandslash), but by restricting some abilities to not be able to share we will now be able to reintroduce them to the tier, this will work similar to how STABmons handles moves, so some other previously banned abilities may also become legal again, but restricted to only the Pokémon that can use them in standard play.
The council will be discussing the abilities that will become restricted, so expect another announcement soon, in the meantime, answer this survey:
https://forms.gle/vKLHrn6kpoFk5Eba7

 

[Wolfein]

Hoping to see some friendly faces come back and some ugly ones go for good. The way i felt the meta evolving these past days, it's really quickly turning into a build-a-sweeper metagame where you can just juggle your 5 first mons around until you see an opportunity to set up your bulky setup sweeper. Players have become quite artistic about it, ranging from stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales+harvest+cosmic power leppa berry, to stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales + immunities + CM/Shift Gear Magearna, not forgetting stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales + immunities + Iron Defense Body Press Zamazenta-C. Common receivers include these two but also Eternatus but actually any bulky mon that could setup (Annihilape, Arceus, Giratina, Mewtwo, Dialga, Cresselia, Diancie, Enamorus-T, Ursaluna Bloodmoon, and who knows else)

And the thing is it's not popular because everyone loves setup so much, it's just good. And really hard to stop for most offensive teams. Obviously Tera exacerbates the issues you encounter when preparing for this strategy as you cannot rely on offensive pressure to deal with them. Dealing with it means getting more defensive, shifting to a more balanced playstyle which eliminates offensive strategies from the get go

 

[Kapwing]

We are addressing Protosynthesis now, is getting banned, but we are waiting on the final council member to vote before announcing results as we need their vote to decide the fate of a different subject. We didn't ban it before because we needed opinions from the public to decide what to do, as it is not an easy decision, as the ability is attached to 8-10 different Pokémon. About Quark Drive, is a bit different, as it requires you to use Pincurchin, and is incompatible with Psychic Surge, meaning that these teams have one mon less and can't do anything to stop priority.

Im not completely sure, but i'm sure enough that they meant unban quick feet and whatever speed controling ability they mentioned that was previously/still banned, because banning protosynthesis bans like 8 pokemon? while only 1 or 2 were truly viable in the tier while the others kinda sucked ass in the metagame, but like i said, im not sure

 

[Kapwing]

Hoping to see some friendly faces come back and some ugly ones go for good. The way i felt the meta evolving these past days, it's really quickly turning into a build-a-sweeper metagame where you can just juggle your 5 first mons around until you see an opportunity to set up your bulky setup sweeper. Players have become quite artistic about it, ranging from stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales+harvest+cosmic power leppa berry, to stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales + immunities + CM/Shift Gear Magearna, not forgetting stamina/ruins/fluffy/ice scales + immunities + Iron Defense Body Press Zamazenta-C. Common receivers include these two but also Eternatus but actually any bulky mon that could setup (Annihilape, Arceus, Giratina, Mewtwo, Dialga, Cresselia, Diancie, Enamorus-T, Ursaluna Bloodmoon, and who knows else)

And the thing is it's not popular because everyone loves setup so much, it's just good. And really hard to stop for most offensive teams. Obviously Tera exacerbates the issues you encounter when preparing for this strategy as you cannot rely on offensive pressure to deal with them. Dealing with it means getting more defensive, shifting to a more balanced playstyle which eliminates offensive strategies from the get go

This is essentially what i stood for before being considered disrespectful, but yea he's aboslutely right, magearna has and probably will shift the metagame into a more balanaced or possibly a defensive metagame which isn't bad per se but it is kinda a problem when a single teamstyle is fucking over the metagame like that specifically, its like bloodmoon-ursaluna, it literally turned blissey a NU pokemon into a OU pokemon, usuage going up by possibly doubling, tripling, quadrupling, possibly even quintupling its usuage from when it in NU

 

[Wolfein]

This is essentially what i stood for before being considered disrespectful, but yea he's aboslutely right, magearna has and probably will shift the metagame into a more balanaced or possibly a defensive metagame which isn't bad per se but it is kinda a problem when a single teamstyle is fucking over the metagame like that specifically

I don't think Magearna is the problem, cause take it away and you can still replace it whith another bulky setup sweeper and the problem stays the same. I don't know if Magearna deserves action, but if it does it cannot be because of this. Players just haven't tried replacing it enough in this kind of team, but believe me playing Cress or Arceus in it's place does the exact same thing

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Abilities that should stay perma banned should be trapping (STag, Arena Trap, Mag Pull could be argued), Mold Breaker (beats the meta too handily), Speed Boost (yeah no no speed boost with Ice Scales Stamina garbage), NGas (beats the meta too handily). and Moody (no) and arguably the Huge/Pure Power (though these could be toyed with). Everything else I think could be made into restricted. Having options like PHeal Guts Gliscor, or real Sun/Rain sweepers that don't break the rest of the meta (Floatzel), or status immuners (Garg).

I think you could pretty safely *RESTRICT* the speed boosting abilities sans Speed Boost itself though.

Slush Rush, Chlorophyll, Swift Swim, Sand Rush should stay banned. Allowing certain Pokemon to keep using an ability while stronger ones cannot is classically against Smogon's banning practices. For example, all Shadow Tag Pokemon are banned from OU, despite Gothorita and Gothita being extremely frail. OMs should maintain this consistency to the best of their ability (hehe pun).

Poison Heal is still broken with Stamina and Ice Scales allowing Gliscor to tank everything except for Ice, which it can just Tera out of.

As for my opinions on ability restrictions (ones not mentioned previously):
Prankster: Prankster could provide a solid counter to set-up sweepers such as Magearna and Zamazenta-C with Haze and Taunt. Restricting it to native Pokemon would be required to prevent broken Destiny Bond strategies and easy recovery from defensive Pokemon.

Quark Drive: Quark Drive gives too much speed. I would say the same for Protosynthesis, but Flutter Mane is still a severe issue.

Shell Armor: I personally believe Shell Armor is the main enabler of Magearna. If Stamina was restricted/banned instead, Magearna would simply switch to using Iron Defense rather than Shift Gear and still be an issue. However, restricting Shell Armor allows the bare minimum counterplay with Urshifu-Rapid-Strike ignoring the defensive boosts and being able to OHKO Magearna. No other Pokemon can currently counter Magearna as reliably. Taunt does not eliminate the threat of Magearna as it can simply come back. However, Water Absorb needs to be suspected as a simple substitute to Shell Armor if Shell Armor is restricted.

Gale Wings: Utterly broken. If egregious speed-boosting abilities such as Slush Rush, Swift Swim, Sand Rush, and Chlorophyll are banned, why should an ability that essentially gives you infinite speed for a move type be allowed?

Huge Power: Azumarill deserves a chance in a meta with Fluffy and Stamina.

Truant: An ability restriction on Truant is unique as it is the only restriction that ironically helps teams instead of hindering them. Slaking might finally see some usage.

Imposter: Imposter would be interesting, however, it might be too difficult to code and open a large discussion of what ability (or abilities) Ditto should copy.

Dazzling, Queenly Majesty, Armor Tail: Bruxish, Tsareena, and Girafarig will have to waste time using speed-boosting moves that do not boost their attacking ability, where they can easily be countered.

Contrary: Lurantis is extremely slow and can easily be countered, however, Enamorus is much more concerning given its high speed. Further discussion and testing is required.

 

[Wolfein]

Slush Rush, Chlorophyll, Swift Swim, Sand Rush should stay banned. Allowing certain Pokemon to keep using an ability while stronger ones cannot is classically against Smogon's banning practices. For example, all Shadow Tag Pokemon are banned from OU, despite Gothorita and Gothita being extremely frail. OMs should maintain this consistency to the best of their ability (hehe pun).

Poison Heal is still broken with Stamina and Ice Scales allowing Gliscor to tank everything except for Ice, which it can just Tera out of.

As for my opinions on ability restrictions (ones not mentioned previously):
Prankster: Prankster could provide a solid counter to set-up sweepers such as Magearna and Zamazenta-C with Haze and Taunt. Restricting it to native Pokemon would be required to prevent broken Destiny Bond strategies and easy recovery from defensive Pokemon.

Quark Drive: Quark Drive gives too much speed. I would say the same for Protosynthesis, but Flutter Mane is still a severe issue.

Shell Armor: I personally believe Shell Armor is the main enabler of Magearna. If Stamina was restricted/banned instead, Magearna would simply switch to using Iron Defense rather than Shift Gear and still be an issue. However, restricting Shell Armor allows the bare minimum counterplay with Urshifu-Rapid-Strike ignoring the defensive boosts and being able to OHKO Magearna. No other Pokemon can currently counter Magearna as reliably. Taunt does not eliminate the threat of Magearna as it can simply come back.

Gale Wings: Utterly broken. If egregious speed-boosting abilities such as Slush Rush, Swift Swim, Sand Rush, and Chlorophyll are banned, why should an ability that essentially gives you infinite speed for a move type be allowed?

Huge Power: Azumarill deserves a chance in a meta with Fluffy and Stamina.

Truant: An ability restriction on Truant is unique as it is the only restriction that ironically helps teams instead of hindering them. Slaking might finally see some usage.

Imposter: Imposter would be interesting, however, it might be too difficult to code and open a large discussion of what ability (or abilities) Ditto should copy.

Dazzling, Queenly Majesty, Armor Tail: Bruxish, Tsareena, and Girafarig will have to waste time using speed-boosting moves that do not boost their attacking ability, where they can easily be countered.

Contrary: Lurantis is extremely slow and can easily be countered, however, Enamorus is much more concerning given its high speed. Further discussion and testing is required.

I agree on some of these, namely Huge Power/Pure Power, Imposter and Poison Heal. However i strongly disagree on other ones.

First on speed boosting abilities, I feel like swift swim being restricted wouldn't really do anything as swift swim users are actually pretty strong on their own, and are varied enough to be overwhelming. Same goes for Chlorophyll, but Sand Rush and Slush Rush feel rather weak. Not only because they have pretty weak abusers (Cetitan being the only maybe here) but also because running snow or sand on top of it would be quite the investment. Not saying it's gonna be bad but I really don't fee like it's threatening at all.

Unlike mister Prankster over here, which is the most outrageous thing i've ever heard of. Unbanning Prankster would require several bans on top of it just to make it bearable : namely Revival Blessing, Shed Tail, Copycat and Destiny Bond. That's without mentioning priority healing moves, status moves, encore, taunt, etc. Nobody wants to open the Prankster Pandora's Box just to fight a mere setup.

Then again, you might think that priority is bad in any form and, maybe it is a bit overbearing at times. However Gale Wings really does not feel THAT strong. I'm not quite adamant about this one but i feel like having hazards, knock off, priority of your own, or Psychic Terrain makes it more or less manageable depending on your team.

Oh yeah and Shell Armor is mid honestly, Magearna is not pushed over the edge by it because "Urshifu ignoring Defense boosts which OHKO it (??????)" doesn't anymore. Fluffy is a thing, so is Tablets of Ruin, and Tera (often Water) as well. Urshifu gets destroyed by stored power/dkiss, and that's hoping it has no sub up. On top of that, you mean to tell me that the Ability is too strong because it counters ONE Pokemon ? Like i'm no expert in these things but i recon maybe the problem is the setup, no the ability that limits crits.

 

[Wolfein]

I've seen Mage teams without it work perfectly fine.

So have I, and I've seen teams working without Stamina as well. On top of that, if the counterplay to bulky-setup is crit then it has no counterplay period. Having to rely on a 1/24 chance not to lose is absurd. There's only like Urshifu and Meowscarada that run 100% crit moves, and crit teams which, let's admit it, are generally not that good. I like the idea of running shell armor to prevent crit on bulky teams, as it makes your defense more reliable, but i really don't think it's what pushes these setup over the edge at all

 

[InkyDarkBird]

I agree on some of these, namely Huge Power/Pure Power, Imposter and Poison Heal. However i strongly disagree on other ones.

First on speed boosting abilities, I feel like swift swim being restricted wouldn't really do anything as swift swim users are actually pretty strong on their own, and are varied enough to be overwhelming. Same goes for Chlorophyll, but Sand Rush and Slush Rush feel rather weak. Not only because they have pretty weak abusers (Cetitan being the only maybe here) but also because running snow or sand on top of it would be quite the investment. Not saying it's gonna be bad but I really don't fee like it's threatening at all.

Unlike mister Prankster over here, which is the most outrageous thing i've ever heard of. Unbanning Prankster would require several bans on top of it just to make it bearable : namely Revival Blessing, Shed Tail, Copycat and Destiny Bond. That's without mentioning priority healing moves, status moves, encore, taunt, etc. Nobody wants to open the Prankster Pandora's Box just to fight a mere setup.

Then again, you might think that priority is bad in any form and, maybe it is a bit overbearing at times. However Gale Wings really does not feel THAT strong. I'm not quite adamant about this one but i feel like having hazards, knock off, priority of your own, or Psychic Terrain makes it more or less manageable depending on your team.

Oh yeah and Shell Armor is mid honestly, Magearna is not pushed over the edge by it because "Urshifu ignoring Defense boosts which OHKO it (??????)" doesn't anymore. Fluffy is a thing, so is Tablets of Ruin, and Tera (often Water) as well. Urshifu gets destroyed by stored power/dkiss, and that's hoping it has no sub up. On top of that, you mean to tell me that the Ability is too strong because it counters ONE Pokemon ? Like i'm no expert in these things but i recon maybe the problem is the setup, no the ability that limits crits.

I think you are confused about my post. I believe Chlorophyll, Sand Rush, Swift Swim, and Slush Rush should still stay banned, and Prankster should be restricted. In fact, I included Destiny Bond as an example.
For your last point, Shell Armor is not mid. Once Magearna gets up one Iron Defense and a Calm Mind, the game is likely over.
KaenSoul also told us to look at abilities that enable Magearna to do what it does, and I'm trying to do that.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

If this is the case, we shouldn't be talking about restricted abilities at all. Why should Sableye be able to benefit from Prankster when Arceus cannot?

This is a fair argument that I disagree with yet cannot respond to in a timely manner without confusing myself. Perhaps an OM Leader would be better suited to talk about this.

No, the pokemon themselves are not, Shadow Tag itself is (and please, don't get any ideas and unban trapping). You can play Gothorita in PU right now if you want to.

Sorry for the confusion. I meant to say that Shadow Tag (a broken ability) is still banned on weak Pokemon (Gothorita and Gothita), despite them basically being unable to do anything.

Giving something like Sableye Fluffy Scales is def not a good idea, do you really wanna get prankster Taunt'd to death by an even more toxic Leppa Berry Harvest set? Because that's what's going to happen.

Sableye has weak defenses that are easily overcome using Long Reach.
In fact, the bulkiest Prankster Pokemon is probably Grimmsnarl, which still has bad defense at 95/65.

I agree with all your other points and that Shared Power has to keep an eye on restricted abilities.

 

[Swampert493]

Thought I'd give my thoughts on the matter. This got long and ramble-y so I cut it down some:

Abilities were banned but should come off as restricted:
1. Armor Tail, Dazzling, Queenly Majesty*

These abilities are overpowered if shared but I'd love to see them come back as a way to revenge kill priority spam teams. Queenly Majesty gets an asterisk because someone mentioned Tsareena Grassy Glide being a problem, which I agree with and would need testing. That being said, I will be running twin beam farigiraf day one.

2. Unaware

Unaware seems like a great strategy to counter the prevalence of set-up strategies we've seen on ladder recently. While combining it with Stamina seem too much, I could see it coming back as it's own thing.

3. Mold Breaker

This may be the most contentious one on here. Excadrill doesn't exist any more and I'll assume Ogerpon-Fire will stay banned. The next best users are Hawlucha and Haxorus, both of which I feel are fine to deal with.


Mudsdale + Stamina

Yes the strategy is very good, but I think Mudsdale provides an important role by limiting the effectiveness of Volt-Turn cores and Multi-Strike strategies. The one limiting factor in-game on abilities is you have to switch them in, and the best way to do that is u-turn. Well, good luck doing that with a Mudsdale on the opponent's team. I say this as a Cloyster-Enjoyer, Mudsdale plays too important of a role in the metagame to get rid of.

Psychic Surge + Quark Drive

These go together because I think they are related. Psychic Surge was more interesting when there were other terrains that could contest it, electric terrain doesn't quite fit the bill at the moment. But for now at least it plays an important niche in limiting priority strategies, and the best part is it's reciprocal so IMO not broken.

Usually I say ban every ability that boost speed, but Quark Drive get's the one exception because it inherently can't work with Psychic Surge, so any priority team can trump a fast Quark Drive user.

Last Respects

I find it hilariously how easily Basculin-White slotted on to teams after Basculegion was banned. Here are their stats for comparison:

252 Adamant Basculin-White w/ Choice Scarf: 311 Attack, 442 Speed
252 Jolly Basculegion w/ Choice Scarf: 323 Attack, 420 Speed
-- For reference, +Speed Nature Dragapult is 421 Speed

Adaptability teams rarely need their Tera's offensively, so running ghost tera Basculin-White means you get the same effect as Basculegion. That being said, I find myself sweeping teams with Aqua Jet just as much if not more than Last Respects, so I think the real problem is Kinggambit/Tera, and I'd like to see action on one of those first.


This isn't all the things on the Survey, but I'd be happy to give my thoughts on the other things if prompted or if there is a discussion.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

main problems with basculin-white (i've been running it for a while now) is that.

A) No STAB on Last Respects kinda sucks, forcing you to tera (or I guess Protean but that ability is kinda garbo in SP)
B) Needs scarf to outspeed most threats (I guess under e-terrain you COULD get away without scarf but like, it'll suck lol)
C) outside of last respects it's kind of outclassed even as a water button clicker (Palafin, Urshifu-R, even Barraskewda)
D) people are still running tera normal for some reason (prolly for houndstone) and you get completely stuffed.

Scarf honestly does not limit Basculin that much, since it is too frail to safely switch in on anything, and its role is mainly a lategame sweeper, which it fulfills well.
Protean isn't that bad as Adaptability is extremely common.
Meowscarada also gets a critical hit move, which y'all know how much I obsess over lol.

It's also Ghost Dark, and the only prankster mon with recover + taunt + sub. That alone could let it "Stall Sweep" in a more effective manner than say, Eternatus. Keep in mind that ruin abilities work quite nicely with taunt.

Well, it cannot really do much with 3 moves used for utility and likely being able to be forced to use Will-O-Wisp to hope to survive against physical attackers.

Shell Armor is a tech for a tech. With how common Stamina is in the meta as well as other forms of double dance, it's natural that people would reach for crits to try and beat that. Shell Armor is only as good as Stamina allows it to be, since without Stamina there's little need to rely on critical hits.

Interesting point. I guess I got tunnel visioned by only looking at Stamina and Shell Armor's effects on Magearna.

There's legitimately only one other move that can currently beat defense stack strats and that's Sacred Sword, something that works... well enough? against Mage but folds hard against Cress, Arc-P, and Etern

Well, there is also Final Gambit, which I ran on regular Basculin at the tradeoff of not being able to use Last Respects.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

sub + harvest (leppa berry) + cheek pouch is legit unkillable by single hit attacks, forcing multi-hits.

Welp, Unnerve Pokemon will sure be popular if Prankster is restricted.

 

[ponchlake]

I don't think Magearna is the problem, cause take it away and you can still replace it whith another bulky setup sweeper and the problem stays the same.

Magearna is in a class of its own as far as bulky sweepers go. People will replace it with other mons, but you can't replicate what Magearna does with any other mon, especially when Soul Heart is an absurd ability that is used in other archetypes of teams besides bulky setup. I feel like everyone is so fixated on that aspect that they forget that Magearna is also broken on HO teams as well.

but believe me playing Cress or Arceus in it's place does the exact same thing

It doesn't because as I previously mentioned Magearna is used outside of bulky setup, as well as the fact that their stats, typing, and abilities aren't anywhere near the same level as Magearna.

Unbanning Prankster would require several bans on top of it just to make it bearable : namely Revival Blessing, Shed Tail, Copycat and Destiny Bond. That's without mentioning priority healing moves, status moves, encore, taunt, etc. Nobody wants to open the Prankster Pandora's Box just to fight a mere setup.

Prankster would be unrestricted and not unbanned.

Enamorus is much more concerning given its high speed

Enamorous would be watchlisted if it is unbanned.

in any scenario Ditto would be broken in the meta. If it copies a duplicate of the opposing pokemon, we have the perfect revenge killer. If it only has your duplicate abilities, we have a stall mon that can't be PP stalled. If it has both? gg.

We would watchlist Ditto if it were unbanned.

However Gale Wings really does not feel THAT strong. I'm not quite adamant about this one but i feel like having hazards, knock off, priority of your own, or Psychic Terrain makes it more or less manageable depending on your team

The only afforementioned thing that handles Gale Wings is Psychic Terrain. They will always run boots, and you're not going to be able to out-priority them since priority spam teams are generally slow outside of priority while Gale Wing teams are fast in general. Priority is still insanely strong even with PsyTerrain legal, so naturally Gale Wings is strong as well. The problem with Gale Wings is that you require more abilities to get it going, but nonetheless it is still incredibly powerful.

It's a good option as a scarf lead with adaptability I've found but it's nothing crazy. Definitely not broken.

It's insane as a late game clearner with scarf and Tera. Requiring only those two things to straight up potentially 6-0 your opponent's team is a small price to pay. I've gotten top of the ladder with it and I know another person who has as well. Having a 350BP STAB attack with other abilities stacked on top of it is going to be stupid, especially when your out is namely priority.

 

[GlalieGoesBoom]

I've gotten reasonable high up on the ladder after a day in the tier with a virtually no skill team.
pokepast.es/9f364e72d0411e48
The premise of the team is to just get +6 defenses on eternatus with cosmic power and sit there slowly chipping away the enemy team. One thing having multiple abilities helps with is limiting counterplay. Here's all the ways that one would normally stop a bulky setup sweeper (or in this case, a defensive, passive setup sweeper) :
- Taunt/Encore
- Running them out of pp, specifically recovery
- Crits
- Phasing
- Passive Damage
- Strong Wallbreakers
The team has ways to hinder or completely shut down all these options. Aroma Veil prevents taunt and encore. Harvest + Leppa Berries means an infinite amount of pp, which can't be removed by knock off or tricked thanks to sticky hold. Crits are blocked by shell armor. Phasing can easily be countered by just sacking all your mons first (Unnecessary if they don't have phaser) . Passive damage comes in the form of leech seed and toxic. Etern has the benefit of outspeeding all defensive mons (along with half the tier), and is able to get a sub up in front of leech seeds and possible whatever else. The only way this could be a problem is population bomb + Toxic chain + Corrosion, which can break the sub and badly poison etern, but it is only one pokemon on a rare gimmicky team style to begin with. As for strong wall breakers, they are managable with the help of memento/phasing/screens support, and most lose to etern once it gets set up. Once you do get set up, tera blast to chip down their team and pp stall out attacking moves. If you can't chip down their team because tera blast doesn't outdamage leftovers/grassy terrain/dry skin, set up an autoclicker and spam recover until turn 1000 / ff. Tera steel helps with setting up, and lets etern beat magerna. The team is weak to hazards, as eternatus would have to waste a turn on recover to get back multiscale. Red card on torkoal helps it potentially phase out a ghost type and spin.
Example: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9sharedpower-1986499727-kdrrgwasd39v7xnyp4jp0hhf1j5a5hnpw?p2

How To PP Stall
At +6 defenses, the only real threats that can break through are other setup sweepers. However, with multiscale, this still fails
The following are examples with etern at +6 and the opposing mon at +6
IF YOU ARE FASTER (Ev 329 speed for Chi-yu)
Click sub twice. This forces you opponet to waste 4 pp to break the subs. This will leave your hp at 51%. Use recover to get back multiscale, meaning you take 1/2 damage from the next attack. Keep clicking recover until they run out of pp. You are fine if they do less than 50 percent with one attack.
IF YOU ARE SLOWER (Most notably against shift gear magerna)
Tera steel to resist stored power. Click recover. Magearna will do less than 50% with multiscale, even if it has +6 from shift gear and calm mind.
In the same turn magearna breaks multiscale, you recover and get it back. Repeat.

Threats
Interestingly, the unnerve part of As one only applies to Calyrex Ice itself, meaning that you can still eat leppa berries in front of other members of the team even if the ability is shared. Might get fixed soon. What this means is that if only have one tera blast pp left and calyrex ice is not in range to be koed, it can survive the tera blast, leaving you with no attacking moves and no way to get back pp. Luckily calyrex ice is weak to steel, and your opponent would have to make a lot of predictions to bait out tera blast pp.
0 SpA Tera Steel Eternatus Tera Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Calyrex-Ice: 192-228 (47.5 - 56.4%) -- 83.2% chance to 2HKO
Perfect blend of tools to counter this team. Swords dance to match boost. Psyblade could potentially 2hko through recover spam, depending on team abilties. Sacred sword for tera steel. Best option against it is to not tera and hope psyblade does less than 50%.

 

[InkyDarkBird]

How To PP Stall
At +6 defenses, the only real threats that can break through are other setup sweepers. However, with multiscale, this still fails
The following are examples with etern at +6 and the opposing mon at +6
IF YOU ARE FASTER (Ev 329 speed for Chi-yu)
Click sub twice. This forces you opponet to waste 4 pp to break the subs. This will leave your hp at 51%. Use recover to get back multiscale, meaning you take 1/2 damage from the next attack. Keep clicking recover until they run out of pp. You are fine if they do less than 50 percent with one attack.
IF YOU ARE SLOWER (Most notably against shift gear magerna)
Tera steel to resist stored power. Click recover. Magearna will do less than 50% with multiscale, even if it has +6 from shift gear and calm mind.
In the same turn magearna breaks multiscale, you recover and get it back. Repeat.

Threats
Interestingly, the unnerve part of As one only applies to Calyrex Ice itself, meaning that you can still eat leppa berries in front of other members of the team even if the ability is shared. Might get fixed soon. What this means is that if only have one tera blast pp left and calyrex ice is not in range to be koed, it can survive the tera blast, leaving you with no attacking moves and no way to get back pp. Luckily calyrex ice is weak to steel, and your opponent would have to make a lot of predictions to bait out tera blast pp.
0 SpA Tera Steel Eternatus Tera Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Calyrex-Ice: 192-228 (47.5 - 56.4%) -- 83.2% chance to 2HKO
Perfect blend of tools to counter this team. Swords dance to match boost. Psyblade could potentially 2hko through recover spam, depending on team abilties. Sacred sword for tera steel. Best option against it is to not tera and hope psyblade does less than 50%.

Unnerve only applies to opposing Pokemon, so it is not a bug.
Otherwise, yikes. This team is just another example (in my eyes) as to why Shell Armor needs a restriction.

 

[Swampert493]

Unnerve only applies to opposing Pokemon, so it is not a bug.

Sorry, could you elaborate on this? I always thought it was a bug too. I don't see why "As one" only applies to opposing Pokemon but the regular "Unnerve" ability is different

 

[Octosquid420]

I've gotten reasonable high up on the ladder after a day in the tier with a virtually no skill team.
pokepast.es/9f364e72d0411e48
The premise of the team is to just get +6 defenses on eternatus with cosmic power and sit there slowly chipping away the enemy team. One thing having multiple abilities helps with is limiting counterplay. Here's all the ways that one would normally stop a bulky setup sweeper (or in this case, a defensive, passive setup sweeper) :
- Taunt/Encore
- Running them out of pp, specifically recovery
- Crits
- Phasing
- Passive Damage
- Strong Wallbreakers
The team has ways to hinder or completely shut down all these options. Aroma Veil prevents taunt and encore. Harvest + Leppa Berries means an infinite amount of pp, which can't be removed by knock off or tricked thanks to sticky hold. Crits are blocked by shell armor. Phasing can easily be countered by just sacking all your mons first (Unnecessary if they don't have phaser) . Passive damage comes in the form of leech seed and toxic. Etern has the benefit of outspeeding all defensive mons (along with half the tier), and is able to get a sub up in front of leech seeds and possible whatever else. The only way this could be a problem is population bomb + Toxic chain + Corrosion, which can break the sub and badly poison etern, but it is only one pokemon on a rare gimmicky team style to begin with. As for strong wall breakers, they are managable with the help of memento/phasing/screens support, and most lose to etern once it gets set up. Once you do get set up, tera blast to chip down their team and pp stall out attacking moves. If you can't chip down their team because tera blast doesn't outdamage leftovers/grassy terrain/dry skin, set up an autoclicker and spam recover until turn 1000 / ff. Tera steel helps with setting up, and lets etern beat magerna. The team is weak to hazards, as eternatus would have to waste a turn on recover to get back multiscale. Red card on torkoal helps it potentially phase out a ghost type and spin.
Example: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9sharedpower-1986499727-kdrrgwasd39v7xnyp4jp0hhf1j5a5hnpw?p2

How To PP Stall
At +6 defenses, the only real threats that can break through are other setup sweepers. However, with multiscale, this still fails
The following are examples with etern at +6 and the opposing mon at +6
IF YOU ARE FASTER (Ev 329 speed for Chi-yu)
Click sub twice. This forces you opponet to waste 4 pp to break the subs. This will leave your hp at 51%. Use recover to get back multiscale, meaning you take 1/2 damage from the next attack. Keep clicking recover until they run out of pp. You are fine if they do less than 50 percent with one attack.
IF YOU ARE SLOWER (Most notably against shift gear magerna)
Tera steel to resist stored power. Click recover. Magearna will do less than 50% with multiscale, even if it has +6 from shift gear and calm mind.
In the same turn magearna breaks multiscale, you recover and get it back. Repeat.

Threats
Interestingly, the unnerve part of As one only applies to Calyrex Ice itself, meaning that you can still eat leppa berries in front of other members of the team even if the ability is shared. Might get fixed soon. What this means is that if only have one tera blast pp left and calyrex ice is not in range to be koed, it can survive the tera blast, leaving you with no attacking moves and no way to get back pp. Luckily calyrex ice is weak to steel, and your opponent would have to make a lot of predictions to bait out tera blast pp.
0 SpA Tera Steel Eternatus Tera Blast vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Calyrex-Ice: 192-228 (47.5 - 56.4%) -- 83.2% chance to 2HKO
Perfect blend of tools to counter this team. Swords dance to match boost. Psyblade could potentially 2hko through recover spam, depending on team abilties. Sacred sword for tera steel. Best option against it is to not tera and hope psyblade does less than 50%.

Holy shit this is evil, I absolutely love it
Leppa berry needs quickbanned IMO, if only two pokemon have a chance of winning against this it's very unhealthy

 

[tommytt22]

anyone running mudsdale falls victim to my merciless maushold.

 

[Kapwing]

I don't think Magearna is the problem, cause take it away and you can still replace it whith another bulky setup sweeper and the problem stays the same. I don't know if Magearna deserves action, but if it does it cannot be because of this. Players just haven't tried replacing it enough in this kind of team, but believe me playing Cress or Arceus in it's place does the exact same thing

im not sure what needs to be banned, possibly the whole teamstyle since banning one pokemon will obviously not be enough, or unban unaware, that's really the only solution i can possibly think of

anyone running mudsdale falls victim to my merciless maushold.

that is a pretty consistent counter to mudsdale

 

[CvdK]

Can we pls ban harvest/leppa or unban more offensive stuff, this set has been complained about before but I just wanted to share how insane high later gameplay is rn. istg like 20% of my games end in a tie and the saddest thing is that this is probably the strongest comp in the meta so why bother playing anything else. It has virtually 0 counters except for the combination of infiltrator and corrosion but why would you ever run that.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9sharedpower-1986499525-0ez5jrzmlz5dpcgpx8rgojlu66dj5hipw

 

[InkyDarkBird]

Sorry, could you elaborate on this? I always thought it was a bug too. I don't see why "As one" only applies to opposing Pokemon but the regular "Unnerve" ability is different

Not sure what you are confused about. Unnerve only applies to opposing Pokemon as well.

 

[Swampert493]

Not sure what you are confused about. Unnerve only applies to opposing Pokemon as well.

Why is the "Chilling Neigh" part of As one shared between pokemon but not the "Unnerve" part. If I have a Mewtwo with Unnerve the ability is shared between my team members. If I have a Glastrier with Chilling Neigh the ability is shared between my team members. But if my pokemon has "As One" as an ability only the Chilling Neigh part is shared not the Unnerve part, that inconsistency sounds like a glitch to me. Maybe someone with familiarity on the coding can weigh in on this?

 

[GlalieGoesBoom]

Why is the "Chilling Neigh" part of As one shared between pokemon but not the "Unnerve" part. If I have a Mewtwo with Unnerve the ability is shared between my team members. If I have a Glastrier with Chilling Neigh the ability is shared between my team members. But if my pokemon has "As One" as an ability only the Chilling Neigh part is shared not the Unnerve part, that inconsistency sounds like a glitch to me. Maybe someone with familiarity on the coding can weigh in on this?

Apparently even if unnerve as its own ability is shared between team members (it has the text when the pokemon switches in) the pokemon wont stop berry consumption. Only the original holder of unnerve can use it
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9sharedpower-1986990442-6yh60dscerdgjqej365wskp75swus0jpw
^Corv only won this exchange (barely) because it has iron defense. Sets with uturn would lose because they are forced to switch out, letting etern eat the leppa berry, and sets with brave bird lose twice the amout of pp because of pressure.