Rhyperior [QC 2/3]

[Jukain]

yes

 

[StViers]

Jukain alexwolf Fire Punch and Roar added to Set Details. Is Dragon Tail worth a mention for the same reason, or is Soundproof not a big enough consideration?

 

[Jukain]

put dtail in oo, roar ignores subs, which is important against foes such as subdd gyarados (you can take a boosted waterfall in a pinch), subtoxic gliscor, etc. for that reason, i'd run roar if i were to run a phazing move.

 

[StViers]

Roar's interaction with Sub noted, and Dragon Tail added to OO. Jukain Thanks for the prompt replies!

 

[Colonel M]

So after playing with it for a little while - leave Sub + 3 Attacks to OO. It's okay but nothing really ground-breaking.

 

[StViers]

Anything else I need to work on towards getting this QC approved?

 

[Jaroda]

Not QC but you should definitely mention Hippowdon or Tyranitar as team mates. The SpD boost helps a lot if combined with Leftovers or Assault Vest and Solid Rock. Not that he will become a special wall, but certainly tank enough to kill would be special revenge attackers. There ability to put down Stealth Rock with the sand really racks up passive damage letting Rhyperior kill things easier

 

[alexwolf]

I am not sure about that. Both Hippo and Ttar share many common weaknesses with Rhyperior. I guess CB/Scarf Tar + Rhyperior or SpD Hippo + PhD Rhyperior can cover both sides of the spectrum and offer different things on a team, but having a defensive core weak to Water + Grass + Ice attacks in the case of the latter is not such a good idea. I think that only choiced or DD Mega Ttar should get a mention as a teammate.

 

[StViers]

alexwolf added Ttar to team options, but I'm not 100% sure my reasoning is comprehensive.

 

[Colonel M]

Tyranitar is okay in general for Rhyperior. Hippowdon not so much.

Choice Tyranitar, AV Tyranitar, and Mega Tyranitar all work fairly well together with Rhyperior for different reasons. I would not mention Hippowdon because it's slightly redundant (Rhyperior and Hippowdon tank roughly the same shit).

 

[Unowninator]

Tyranitar is okay in general for Rhyperior. Hippowdon not so much.

Choice Tyranitar, AV Tyranitar, and Mega Tyranitar all work fairly well together with Rhyperior for different reasons. I would not mention Hippowdon because it's slightly redundant (Rhyperior and Hippowdon tank roughly the same shit).

Why not mention Hippowdon solely to advise against it?

 

[StViers]

Because that's not a useful track in writing projects like this. It should be assumed that if something isn't mentioned in a category that there's a reason.

 

[StViers]

bump for additional critiques/QC imput

 

[trc]

for the love of god no quakeedge

But seriously, I think that the checks and counters need more examples, particularly of the powerful special attackers. Think things like Keldeo, Manaphy, Mega Venusaur (though it is a defensive mon, it is certainly powerful enough), Celebi, Roserade, other powerful special water- and grass-types that shit all over rhyperior.

 

[StViers]

TRC. Thanks for the input on specific OU special threats! Added those pokes, and gave Mega-Venusaur it's own special section as it is probably one of the best all around check to Rhyperior along with (Mega-)Blastoise

 

[CyclicCompound]

What TRC was trying to say is that it's EdgeQuake, not QuakeEdge (it's actually in the spelling/grammar rules). But that's just a minor nitpick.

 

[StViers]

CyclicCompound I figured that out, but then missed all the uses of it in the Moves section(s). Went through and substituted the right phrase. Thanks!

 

[Dark_Plague]

Should Avalanche be considered at all under "Other Options" vs Ice Punch? Not going to go so far as to suggest slashing it, but tanking an Earthquake from a Gliscor/Landorus-T when you're running a full 252 HP/Def Impish set and retaliating with a 120 power Ice Move as opposed to the 75 power Ice Punch makes taking them down a bit more of a certainty. Seems to have been working well for me on the ladder, grabbing more surprise KOs than usual.

0 Atk Rhyperior Avalanche vs. 252 HP / 184+ Def Gliscor: 300-356 (84.7 - 100.5%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

-1 0 Atk Rhyperior Avalanche vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Landorus-T: 264-312 (69.2 - 81.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

vs

0 Atk Rhyperior Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 184+ Def Gliscor: 188-224 (53.1 - 63.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Poison Heal (>implying no Protect)

-1 0 Atk Rhyperior Ice Punch vs. 248 HP / 244 Def Landorus-T: 164-196 (43 - 51.4%) -- 55.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Just a thought.

EDIT: A lot of Landorus-T/Gliscor seem to think they can get in a free Knock Off vs Rhyperior as well, which hasn't ended well for them.

 

[dice]

slash toxic with ice punch to nail defog users and hippo. be sure to emphasize this thing kinda blows

qc 1/3

 

[Alphanex20]

for the love of god no quakeedge

But seriously, I think that the checks and counters need more examples, particularly of the powerful special attackers. Think things like Keldeo, Manaphy, Mega Venusaur (though it is a defensive mon, it is certainly powerful enough), Celebi, Roserade, other powerful special water- and grass-types that shit all over rhyperior.

You forgot Rotom-W and Rotom-C (it's a thing people!) as hard-counters. They can easily take one stone edge (if they are defensive in some way), then either burn or OHKO you (or volt switch/pain split/ChestoRest if they predict a switch). Burned Rhyperior is a worthless Rhyperior, unfortunately.

 

[CyclicCompound]

You forgot Rotom-W and Rotom-C (it's a thing people!) as hard-counters. They can easily take one stone edge (if they are defensive in some way), then either burn or OHKO you (or volt switch/pain split/ChestoRest if they predict a switch). Burned Rhyperior is a worthless Rhyperior, unfortunately.

Rotom-W, yes, but I wouldn't mention Rotom-C. It's far too uncommon.

 

[alexwolf]

Mention how Rhyperior is one of the very few good counters to both Mega Pinsir and Mega Charizard X, one of the main reasons to use it in the first place.

 

[CyclicCompound]

I would definitely add to OO a Rock Polish + Weakness Policy sweeper. It's a little gimmicky, but if you can switch into something that will give you a free EQ or something, Rhyperior can outspeed everything up to fully invested base 128 speed (enough to get past Greninja), and is ridiculously hard to take down with priority (CB Azumarill can't even OHKO with Aqua Jet!). With all of that said, it's still a gimmick since many players will go for the OHKO with a STAB special Water- or Grass-type move than let weakness policy be activated by something like an un-STABbed EQ, so I wouldn't make any mention of it outside of OO.

 

[Alphanex20]

Rotom-W, yes, but I wouldn't mention Rotom-C. It's far too uncommon.

And stupid me forgot it is weak to Ice Punch lol.

 

[CyclicCompound]

Not QC, but I'd definitely make sure you put mention in the overview of some of the things other than Talonflame that Rhyperior checks. alexwolf put it very well in his post:

You check a ton of dangerous sweepers, such as Mega Char X, Garchomp, Mega Pinsir, Talonflame, Excadrill, Dragonite, Shift Gear Genesect, and Mega Mawile. Just make sure to stick to keeping in check one of those mons, as otherwise Rhyperior gets worn down easily and fails to hold back his targets at late-game.

That pretty much summarizes both Rhyperior's role and its strategy, so I'd definitely highlight that as one of its strengths: the fact that Rhyperior can essentially choose one of the above Pokemon to deal with and deal with it quite reliably. All of the Pokemon mentioned above are extremely threatening and serve as a lot of offensive teams' win conditions, which is basically the entire (and only) selling point of Rhyperior.

Another thing that may be worth mentioning is that Rhyperior is an excellent check to the popular Staraptor + Talonflame offensive combo. It can't be 2HKO'd by any of Staraptor's moves, and is a near-total stop to Talonflame.