ORAS Doubles OU Rain Offense

[charlie.x.3000]

Intro:
This is a team that I've found to be lots of fun playing with (Sadly didn't remember to keep a couple replays, will edit them in when I have them). I've found that this team has brought me the most success out of the teams I've made. I want to see what I can do to improve on it however.

Team:
As a rain team, I obviously needed Politoed to set the rain. To take advantage of the rain, I wanted 2 swift swimming mons, for which I chose Kingdra and Mega Swampert. I needed someone that would take out ChariYard easily, and I chose Thundurus Incarnate. It can also provide lots of support for my team. Landorus for the Intimidate and an insurance against ChariYard. Shaymin-Sky was chosen to help against opposing water types and grass types.

The Team:

Politoed @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Rain Dance
- Helping Hand
- Protect

This is my rain setter. Damp rock will often allow me to not have to set rain again in the entire game. Scald is the main stab, and can also get that nifty burn. Rain Dance is there to counter opposing Mega Ttar and Mega ChariYard. It will prevent Sand Rush and Chlorophyll from activating, and ensure the swift swimmers are still fast, even if they lose the Rain Boost in the middle of the turn. Helping Hand is mainly there to help with Kingdra's Muddy Water. Protect is a good move that stalls out TW, TR, Fakeout, and keeps Politoed alive. Maximum Special bulk because I've found most grass and electric type attacks are special, and because Landorus-Therian will help with the physical bulk.

Kingdra @ Choice Specs
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Muddy Water
- Draco Meteor
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump

Muddy Water is the main drawing point of Kingdra. Specs+Rain+Helping Hand will allow Muddy Water to OHKO main things, such as Mega Kangaskhan. Draco Meteor is a secondary STAB and used when the target resists water and needs the extra damage. Ice Beam hits Landorus-Therian hard and is used as coverage. Hydro Pump for when Muddy Water won't KO. Max Speed and SpAtk to hit as hard and fast as possible. Modest because I don't need that much speed and extra damage is more relevent.

Swampert-Mega @ Swampertite
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Ice Punch
- Protect

Swampertite is for Mega Evolution to get Swift Swim. Waterfall hits hard in rain and is the only physical water STAB Swampert gets. Earthquake as a secondary STAB. I have 3 ground immunes to not get hit by friendly fire. Ice Punch to hit Landorus-Therian, who really likes to come in on Swampert to get the -1. Protect is needed to safely Mega Evolve the first turn and get the Swift Swim boost. EVs and Nature are for maximum Atk, and the rest is put into Speed to outspeed in Rain.

Thundurus @ Life Orb
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Rain Dance

Thundurus started out as the main Mega ChariYard counter since it OHKOs ChariYard with Thunderbolt. It has now become more of a TR counter. Thunder Wave is great for yellow magic. It also serves as speed control if my swift swimmers are unavailable. Taunt to counter Trickroom. If that fails, I've paralyzed my own Mons to be slower in TR. Rain Dance is also counterplay against opposing weather, but unlike Politoed, the +1 priority rain dance means that Water moves still get boosted.

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Superpower

Landorus-T brings intimidate drops to annoy those physical attackes and lengthen Politoed's lifespan. Scarf is nessecary to help prevent Landorus-T from getting hit by SE moves and getting KO'd. U-turn to switch out before getting hit by an ice move while dealing damage at the same time. Superpower OHKOs Mega Kangaskhan and provides coverage. Earthquake is powerful on Landorus-T, but the scarf lock Lando into it, preventing Landorus-T from rock sliding the resulting flying types that come in. The spread maxes out Atk while still outspeeding threats up to Mega Manectric, with the rest of the EVs put into HP for some bulk.

Shaymin-Sky @ Focus Sash
Ability: Serene Grace
Shiny: Yes
Happiness: 0
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seed Flare
- Air Slash
- Earth Power
- Protect

Sash is mandatory on Skymin, allowing it to stay in on OHKO moves. Skymin OHKOs most water types with Seed Flare, and heavily damages Venusaur with Air Slash. Both of these moves also have nice secondary effects that get boosted by Serene Grace. Earth Power is there to deal with Heatran, who 4x resists Skymin's other moves. However, due to the amount of water and ground moves already on this team, a suggestion for a replacement for Earth Power will be nice. Protect allows Skymin to stall TR and TW, field conditions with heavily limit Skymin's usefulness and allow Skymin's partner to take out threats.

Conclusion:
I feel this team has some problem against Ice, due to having 3 Ice weaknesses and only 1 resist. Fortunately, as a Offense team, a weakness doesn't mean anything if opposing mons get KO'd fast. ChariYard has been a problem in certain games. Kyurum-B can be a problem to the team.

Replays:
I'll post 'em here when I get them.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/doublesoususpecttest-257911300

 

[qsns]

Yo, cool team. It looks like it's able to put on a ton of offensive pressure while having a decent core to switch around with and I haven't seen a Swampert + Kingdra team in ORAS yet :o. That being said, there are some matchups that this team has some serious issues with.

As you mentioned in your conclusion, Kyurem-B looks like an absolute nightmare for this team to face. Your best way to hit it at the moment is Kingdra, which forces a lock into Draco Meteor. This could potentially lose a ton of momentum if they switch out, something your team cannot afford to lose. Additionally, if it sets up a Substitute, you will be hard pressed to break the sub without losing a mon.

Another weakness of this team is the Ferrothorn matchup. After getting up a Leech Seed, it's almost impossible for your team to effectively deal with it and it serves as an effective win condition even in the early game as it can just sit there and recover health while dealing major damage to your team with its high power STAB moves.

Both of those are ever present weaknesses to rain though so I don't think it's a bad team :P but I think I can change a few things to make the matchup easier.

Superpower > Ice Punch on Swampert is one of the quicker and easier ways to fix this issue as both Ferro and Kyube are weak to Fighting type moves. Almost all Skymin are Sash these days so Ice Punch is not a good check to them, and Landorus-T is actually hit harder by a Rain-boosted Waterfall than Ice Punch. Although you do not come anywhere near close to an OHKO, a Helping Hand boost from Poli or some chip damage off of a Kingdra Muddy Water will both put them in kill range.

Bit of a "radical" change but I really don't think Skymin serves you well on this team. It exacerbates a bad matchup to the above two and doesn't provide much besides an EQ immunity for Swampert. Therefore, I'm suggesting Cobalion > Shaymin-S to patch up some weaknesses. Cobalion gives you another Fighting Type to check Ferrothorn and Kyube and provides a shaky switchin to both. Additionally, it provides you with a steel type, which rain really likes for defensive purposes, as well as a more solid Mega Kangaskhan check. Stone Edge OHKOs all variants of Charizard Y so it also helps with a weakness mentioned in your conclusion. On this team, I'd opt for Taunt over a second STAB move to shut down Amoonguss, something you don't want to give many free turns to.

This is a more of a personal preference but I don't think Specs is the best item on Kingdra. Life Orb > Specs has been more consistent for me in the past because it's really valuable to be able to Protect with Kingdra in dangerous situations. Considering this is a more offensive team that doesn't want to be forced out as much, I think this set fits better. I like Hydro Pump in the third slot to hit Aegislash for a metric fuckton of damage but other options include Disable, Substitute, Scald, and even Rain Dance. Ice Beam has really really redundant and unnecessary coverage.

Final note, Rain Dance on Poli is kinda weird if you're not a scarf variant. Chary + Venu just ends up killing you anyways and something like Encore > Rain Dance would benefit you more. Icy Wind, Ice Beam, and Perish Song (to win against the last 2 mons for sure) are also all viable.

Good luck with your team, this should help you fix your poor matchups if you decide to go with these changes. I like the idea of non Ludi rain and I think you executed it well.

sets

Swampert-Mega @ Swampertite
Ability: Damp
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Superpower
- Protect

Cobalion @ Life Orb
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Taunt
- Protect

Kingdra @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Muddy Water
- Draco Meteor
- Hydro Pump
- Protect

Politoed @ Damp Rock
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Encore
- Helping Hand
- Protect

calcs

252+ Atk Mega Swampert Superpower vs. 108 HP / 0 Def Kyurem-B: 320-378 (76.5 - 90.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Mega Swampert Superpower vs. 252 HP / 84 Def Ferrothorn: 238-280 (67.6 - 79.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Life Orb Cobalion Close Combat vs. 108 HP / 0 Def Kyurem-B: 398-471 (95.2 - 112.6%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Cobalion Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 84 Def Ferrothorn: 296-351 (84 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Cobalion Close Combat vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 398-471 (113 - 133.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Life Orb Cobalion Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 64 Def Mega Charizard Y: 499-593 (138.9 - 165.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

 

[charlie.x.3000]

The thing is with LO Kingdra, it can't really OHKO Mega Kangaskahn:
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Helping Hand Muddy Water vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Kangaskhan in Rain: 328-387 (93.1 - 109.9%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Life Orb Kingdra Helping Hand Muddy Water vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Kangaskhan in Rain: 285-335 (80.9 - 95.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
It's the only thing that it's for, but I guess Kangskhan Fake Outs first, so LO works too.
I've implemented the other changes too.

I've removed Skymin, but I feel that I need an answer to opposing water types. Nothing except Thundy is SE on water right now, and I want a bit more insurance.

 

[qsns]

with cobalion, killing kangaskhan really shouldnt be an issue because it gives you a second switchin into it. I think the idea was good without the change but I don't think it suits the team now; also, having poli out on the field to kill kangaskhan isn't really a reliable method to check it.

I think it's fair to say your team struggles with opposing rain (specifically ludicolo) but cobalion and swampert should be able to dent it massively with their respective fighting type moves while thundurus can paralyze it to make it much easier to deal with. A possible change that could help this is Jolly Landorus-T > Adamant to outspeed and throw off the normal Ludicolo spread and give you the ability to kill it with U-Turn with the help of some chip damage. This would also aid in outspeeding Venusaur spreads with less Speed, giving you the kill on Charizard-Y before getting Sleep Powder'd or HP Ice'd.

 

[Electrolyte]

I honestly think Landorus-T is the one that needs to be replaced, not Skymin. Both by themselves provide more Speed for the team but clash when they're both on it; Skymin actually provides valuable coverage against Grass- and Water-types and, with Air Slash and a Focus Sash, is much more suited for this type of hyper offensive team. Landorus-T on the other hand doesn't help provide anything new to the team; Earthquake spread coverage is already handled by Swampert, and Rock-type coverage can be handled by Cobalion. Intimidate helps but not enough, since hard hitting prio moves that you should be worrying about in the first place still hit hard (BBird and Sucker still 2HKO Kingdra). Skymin also has much better synergy with Cobalion, and the two form a pretty nice anti-anti rain core.

Also, Life Orb Kingdra is more reliable than Specs Kingdra. Beating Mega Kangaskhan is a poor reason to use Specs over Life Orb because Kingdra shouldn't be trying to beat Mega Kangaskhan and can't 100% of the time anyway. Trying to set up a confrontation will make Kingdra take a lot of unnecessary damage and will result in losing some rain turns as you cant Protect yourself from the Fake Out. The ability to nail opponents with the right coverage is a lot more useful than raw power, which is brought on naturally from the dual sweeper nature of your Swift Swim setup.

LO Kingdra also frees up Mega Swampert to use Superpower, again, instead of Ice Punch, letting you hit Ferrothorn and Kyurem-B.


If you want to put the time in you could also maximize the effectiveness of your spreads; Kingdra prefers a spread of 124 HP / 252 SpA / 132 Spe Modest, which is the fastest you really need to go (beating neutral 252 EV base 70s outside of rain), giving you slightly more bulk. 100 HP / 252 Atk / 156 Spe Adamant is just enough for Mega Swampert as well, as it creeps typical Ludicolo, though your simple 252 / 252 spread is great as well to be solid vs Ludicolo and to always outspeed all Scarf Landorus-T.


Cool team!