In all honesty; that feature should be removed from the OU thread as sets and analyses are constantly changing. It's also a pain to keep updating them here as well as formatting them; often ending up in incorrect programming and links - you've probably seen on the OU VR things like chesnaught leading to chansey - and it's honestly kind of pointless. Might as well just manually go to the analyses on the forums themselves; it takes like a minute
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ORAS UU Viability Ranking Thread M2
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I'd like to make an interesting nomination.
Mega Houndoom B- ---> B
I'm making this nomination based not on anything to do with its usage of Nasty Plot, but rather of its Sunny Day set. Solar Power and the sun boost makes it very difficult to switch into its Fire Blasts:
Even demolishing resists:
And, in the case of SunnyBeam, UU's favourite bulky Water types cannot switch in safely:
Its unique Fire/Dark typing also grants it some neat resistances to Dark, Ghost, Fire, Grass, and Steel, as well as an immunity to Psychic and Fire (before Mega Evolution); resistances which allow it some neat switchin oppurtunities vs. threats like Chandelure, Roserade, and Forretress, as well as vs. Choice locked fire types like Entei, Darmanitan, and again, Chandelure. Sure, it's not going to dominate the meta, but it's a neat wallbreaker to have and can apply a lot of pressure.
Mega Houndoom B- ---> B
I'm making this nomination based not on anything to do with its usage of Nasty Plot, but rather of its Sunny Day set. Solar Power and the sun boost makes it very difficult to switch into its Fire Blasts:
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon in Sun: 256-303 (64.9 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0- Atk Umbreon Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Houndoom: 39-47 (13.4 - 16.1%) -- 0.7% chance to 4HKO after Solar Power damage (This is with 0 attack IVs)
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 24+ SpD Florges in Sun: 262-310 (72.7 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Florges Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Houndoom: 123-145 (42.2 - 49.8%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Solar Power damage
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Empoleon in Sun: 306-360 (82.2 - 96.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Empoleon Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Houndoom in Sun: 102-122 (35 - 41.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Solar Power damage
0- Atk Umbreon Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Houndoom: 39-47 (13.4 - 16.1%) -- 0.7% chance to 4HKO after Solar Power damage (This is with 0 attack IVs)
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 24+ SpD Florges in Sun: 262-310 (72.7 - 86.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 SpA Florges Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Houndoom: 123-145 (42.2 - 49.8%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Solar Power damage
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Empoleon in Sun: 306-360 (82.2 - 96.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 SpA Empoleon Scald vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Houndoom in Sun: 102-122 (35 - 41.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Solar Power damage
Even demolishing resists:
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Hydreigon in Sun: 233-274 (71.6 - 84.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Tentacruel in Sun: 183-216 (50.6 - 59.8%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Salamence in Sun: 256-302 (77.3 - 91.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyrantrum in Sun: 163-192 (53.2 - 62.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Tentacruel in Sun: 183-216 (50.6 - 59.8%) -- 85.9% chance to 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Salamence in Sun: 256-302 (77.3 - 91.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Tyrantrum in Sun: 163-192 (53.2 - 62.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And, in the case of SunnyBeam, UU's favourite bulky Water types cannot switch in safely:
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 200 HP / 56+ SpD Vaporeon in Sun: 370-436 (82 - 96.6%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune in Sun: 368-434 (91 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Swampert in Sun: 904-1068 (225.4 - 266.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 200 HP / 56 SpD Seismitoad in Sun: 252-297 (62.8 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 208 HP / 0 SpD Mega Swampert in Sun: 764-900 (194.4 - 229%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Suicune in Sun: 368-434 (91 - 107.4%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 240 HP / 0 SpD Swampert in Sun: 904-1068 (225.4 - 266.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Fire Blast vs. 200 HP / 56 SpD Seismitoad in Sun: 252-297 (62.8 - 74%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Solar Power Mega Houndoom Solar Beam vs. 208 HP / 0 SpD Mega Swampert in Sun: 764-900 (194.4 - 229%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Its unique Fire/Dark typing also grants it some neat resistances to Dark, Ghost, Fire, Grass, and Steel, as well as an immunity to Psychic and Fire (before Mega Evolution); resistances which allow it some neat switchin oppurtunities vs. threats like Chandelure, Roserade, and Forretress, as well as vs. Choice locked fire types like Entei, Darmanitan, and again, Chandelure. Sure, it's not going to dominate the meta, but it's a neat wallbreaker to have and can apply a lot of pressure.
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Snorlax for A+
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-ou-43868
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-ou-43868
Why is there a starmie, it hasn't been in the tier for an entire month. Plus can tou explain why snorlax deserves A+
because it 6-0s ppl with bo regard for human life. that was an xy replay btw which is why starmie was there. Snorlax is crazy good though.
This was in the UUPL for XYUU (right before Starmie went up). I don't think this is a good barometer for Snorlax in the current UU because there was no Heracross or Salamence to additionally pressure him.
That was a UUPL replay of an XYUU match. I assumed that post was a joke as to why Snorlax should be A+ since XYUU isn't relevant anymore aside from UUPL anyway.
It might be a replay that shows it 6-0ing someone, but most pokemon have the ability to do that, plus it started setting up on a bronzong, which is set-up fodder for it.
With that we are no longer in the XY meta, but unstead, in the ORAS meta which is pretty different from the XY meta.
Plus you still din't explain why it deserves A+, and a replay if it setting up to win 6-0 is not an explanation.
Edit; Ninja'd as fuq.
Most mons do not have that ability snorlax is not only a very strong wincon but also an entei counter that does not fear burn which is a rare quality tbh lax probably threatens an equal amount if not more teams than gatr since it can tank prio and is only his SE by fighting types which once removed give lax great sweeping opportunities. Also it gets a bonus for having 30% para with slam so not much wants to switch in. On mobile btw so sorry for a poor quality post
Hitmonlee for C rank
So Hitmonlee is actually pretty useful. Basically it's LO Reckless Mienshao, but you give up U-turn, coverage (Poison Jab/Stone Edge), and base 105 speed for Rapid Spin, priority, and decent special bulk (50/110 is slightly better than that of the Rotom formes, which lets Hitmonlee do stuff like survive a Scarf Hydreigon's Draco from full). Obviously Mienshao is usually superior (mostly due to the speed difference), but an offensive Rapid Spinner which also doubles as a good wallbreaker can be useful for offensive teams with stuff like Entei or Mega Abomasnow which can't fit Crobat/offensive Empoleon/Defog Aero. Also Spin > Defog, which is another bonus over those other offensive hazard removers. Priority can also be nice, letting Hitmonlee revenge stuff LO Mienshao can't like weakened +2 Mega Abomasnow and Scarf Hydreigon. All in all I believe the niches it has over Shao in priority, special bulk, and especially Rapid Spin make Hitmonlee deserving of C rank.
Hitmonlee (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rapid Spin
- High Jump Kick
- Knock Off
- Mach Punch
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rapid Spin
- High Jump Kick
- Knock Off
- Mach Punch
So Hitmonlee is actually pretty useful. Basically it's LO Reckless Mienshao, but you give up U-turn, coverage (Poison Jab/Stone Edge), and base 105 speed for Rapid Spin, priority, and decent special bulk (50/110 is slightly better than that of the Rotom formes, which lets Hitmonlee do stuff like survive a Scarf Hydreigon's Draco from full). Obviously Mienshao is usually superior (mostly due to the speed difference), but an offensive Rapid Spinner which also doubles as a good wallbreaker can be useful for offensive teams with stuff like Entei or Mega Abomasnow which can't fit Crobat/offensive Empoleon/Defog Aero. Also Spin > Defog, which is another bonus over those other offensive hazard removers. Priority can also be nice, letting Hitmonlee revenge stuff LO Mienshao can't like weakened +2 Mega Abomasnow and Scarf Hydreigon. All in all I believe the niches it has over Shao in priority, special bulk, and especially Rapid Spin make Hitmonlee deserving of C rank.
Can we get some talk about this? I've never used houndoom but im currious as to why its ranked rather low
Cause chandelure does a lot of the same stuff but better and while doom is cool on paper he is much less efficient in practice tbh
Edit: also doom is one of the worse megas available in UU
I think its mostly because of its opportunity cost in being a mega and the fact that bulky Water-types and Hydreigon are so prominent in UU.
Plus Solar Power, while making him really strong, cuts into already shallow bulk and makes him even weaker to priority (he's already susceptible to all forms of hazard damage as well)
I would like to nominate Roserade to move up to A-. With how water filled the metagame is currently we have seen the rise of Shaymin as a counter for them. On more of my offensive teams I thought, why not Roserade? Roserade brings with it fairly nice stopping power with LeaF Storm and Sludge bomb, acting as a bulky water check as well as a grass and electric check, (Scarf can also be used as an emergency Mienshao check but that's extremely niche). Roserade's main role is its ability to utilize sleep powder (often on the switch) in order to set up spikes on a very large portion of the meta. Anything slower than Roserade is set up fodder, and faster things often have to worry about the sleep on the switch. This utility, combined with its offensive prowess, I believe deserves A- Rank, as it not only sets up spikes for offensive teams, but also acts as a way to break through bulky waters, check Suicune, and murder Florges. It's combination of offensive pressure and utility allow it to function as a pivotal part of many offensive teams, toxic spikes is also an option, albeit a more niche one. It can also run more offensive sets with Technician HP Fire or Extrasensory, as well as having giga drain for a recovery option. Natural cure is also extremely nice in this scald infested meta.
I don't think they really do the same thing much of the time since Chandy definitely has a bunch of options it can utilize and Houndoom has its variants of the Nasty Plot set, but I do agree that as special attackers, Chandelure boasts a lot more useful qualities, including a superior ability (after doom m-evolves), a better defensive typing (fighting immunity is arguably more important in this meta and it retains Chandy's Fairy resistance), a more reliable Grass-type move (Houndoom either needs hp grass or solarbeam, the latter of which needs sun support), a greater degree of versatility as it has the choice to beat/cripple threats one way or another in a more broad manner than Mega Houndoom does, and very importantly the fact it doesn't take a mega slot. Overall, Chandy is a lot more useful than Megadoom in most cases/roles in the current metagame, thus its appropriate placement in the vr here.
Moving
Doublade B -> B+ offensively checks/counters prominant threats in the tier such as Cresselia, Crobat and Mega Aero, while also sponging hits from fairies and physical attackers without strong supereffective stab. Access to SD give it sweeping capabilities and its natural bulk combined with eviolite make it an excellent tank.
Will be going over more changes during the weekend as I discuss them with the council.
Doublade B -> B+ offensively checks/counters prominant threats in the tier such as Cresselia, Crobat and Mega Aero, while also sponging hits from fairies and physical attackers without strong supereffective stab. Access to SD give it sweeping capabilities and its natural bulk combined with eviolite make it an excellent tank.
Will be going over more changes during the weekend as I discuss them with the council.
Don't really see how that justifies moving it down to B. A bunch of pokemon can't take hits, Mega Beedrill, Alakazam, Mienshao, etc. Mega Sceptile is an offensive pokemon hence the reason for its inability to take hits. Also the fact that "other megas are more viable" is basically saying move downes all megas besides Aerodactyl because they're lower on the viability ranking.
I'm saying that with the current meta most pokes can take a hit from it besides suicine, and it's best move leaf storm leaves it as a huge setup fodder for multiple pokes including slurpuff for example
and plus so many of the top tier threats can beat this easily 1v1 such as mega aero, mega pidgeot, scarf mence, sash alakazam, cress, entei, scarf cross, scarf dreigon, scarf shao, nidoqueen, mega beedrill, Crobat, florges,
This may sound a little jank, but Mega Aerodactyl being so much better (generally) than every other Mega IS reason for a lot of Megas to drop rank. There's huge opportunity cost to using any other Mega and Aerodactyl beats most of them 1v1, so you're inherently at a disadvantage.
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