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I've gone ahead and added a new commonly rejected idea to the OP, which is variants of Inheritance. We see far too many of these, and there is little reason to look at any of them when Inheritance is already one of our most popular metagames and captures the idea of using the moves/abilities of other Pokemon in an interesting but not particularly complicated way.
Tool Swap (WIP)
Metagame premise: You can take any ability you want, as long a Pokémon with this ability has your movepool! The purpose is to make something similar to AAA, but with more links between mons. Also to see funny relations between movepools.
Functionement:
Alohomora (Scream Tail) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Play Rough
- Wish
- Protect
- Light Screen
So, all of Scream Tail’s moves are also obtainable on other Pokémon, in this case the one we are interested in is Alomomola. Scream Tail is allowed to take Alomomolas Abilities. It could also take Pixilated, Static, Cute Charm, Competitive, Hydration, Healer and Lighting Rod. Meta would be a lot based on scouting I guess, with a lot of Stall as all stalkers are the same. On the other hand, Mold Breaker could be the path to freedom.
Potential bans and threats: Broken AAA stuff.
Huge/Pure Power are obviously broken, especially Pure Power since its movepool is wide enough. Iron Hands especially can run a classic set.
Iron Hands @ Punching Glove
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Thunder Punch
- Close Combat
Poison Heal may be OP, but I doubt it, maybe some would like to run ToxicSubSeed.
Stakeout’s without a doubt broken, Roaring Moon can run a Band set with a normal movepool.
Comatose is probably fine, as Komala hasn’t Rose.
Questions for the community:
Other bannable things? Should inheriting from NDex/Unreleased be allowed?
This falls into a very common trap, which is that this, as said before, is pretty much just Inheritance. We receive many suggestions for more limited versions of Inheritance, and none get approved.
so one day, i was in om room as usual, talking what omotm would be next and a brilliant idea for an om struck in my head:
'what if tera affected your moves, like revmons?'
so now here i am, bringing you this fun idea for an om: Trevmons! (very original name ik)
-'how would it work tho?'
basically, you set your tera type in teambuilder and the LAST MOVE in your pokemons moveslot is going to be that typing.
lets say i put tera fairy on chi yu and its last move being fire blast. when in battle, chi yu would have a fairy type fire blast!
also small edit here: i think chi yu alongside other pokemon are going to be monstrous in this tier, so yea
i also had the idea of making this a 'pre-gen 4' om style, where your tera type affects the last move if its physical or special. so like tera fire would be physical, tera psychic would be special etc.
-'what about tera fairy? that didnt exist back in gen 3!'
just make it special idk
so, thats it! hopefully this would be submitted as an om or even help me guys out with the name and even fixing it!
This is rather similar to Revelationmons, as many Pokemon would simply get a stronger or more spammable STAB attack, such as Extreme Speed Dragonite. However I like the coverage options that this would provide are the interesting part of this metagame, and also its potential fatal downside. Offensive Pokemon being able to reveal a powerful coverage move at any time makes any defensive counterplay that isn't raw bulk a gamble. I don't think it's a terrible idea, but my instinct is that there's no way to keep the meta balanced and avoid it being a series of rather baseless guesses about tera types.
A way to begin fixing this might be to have the move Tera Blast be the move that changes pre-tera, rather than any move ever. It's fairly weak, is obviously the changed move, and cannot have absurd effects like priority or boosting. I am open to other suggestions for how to fix the above issues, but as of now they would have to be resolved before I would approve.
The pre-gen 4 style would have to go. There is no way we'd approve this with two mechanically unrelated concepts, especially without a clear path for Fairy to follow.
Can Game Freak release a game with pre-gen 4 physical special split and Fairy types already smh we all know it would be special but need to stick with objectivity...
Names are a weakness of mine I won't lie. Trevmons is... bad. Doesn't give us the slightest clue what it is. Sorry. However I don't have any ideas that are any better so no judgement
You would need 20 quality posts minimum in the OM forum before your submission would even be considered so I would recommend getting that before submitting. Remember that this is a bare minimum; if we see you making 20 posts at once just to hit the minimum and think you are unlikely to stick around we are less likely to trust you with the long-term development of a metagame.
Share-a-Type(okay yeah this name sucks I just wanted to make a pun)
Premise: You bring a team of six Pokémon, the order in the team doesn't matter. Each Pokémon has a Tera-type selected. The first Pokémon you send out Terastylizes the moment Turn 1 starts. From that moment on, every Pokémon on your team now has this type as STAB. They only get this benefit offensively, not defensively.
Strategy: Each Pokémon on your team would have a different Tera-type, and you could choose which Tera type would be shared with your team by seeing the opponent's team during Team Preview. Setting up multiple members of your team with enough coverage for different shared types allows for interesting offenses, and having the Tera Pokémon reveal themselves right from the start means you already know what your opponent has defensively.
Bans/Restrictions: OU Banlist, Same Tera restrictions as above (Cannot Tera into a type you already have, maybe cannot Tera into a type of someone on your team?)
I haven't read all the feedback you've gotten, but I like this overall. However I think it would be better if, instead of just being an offensive buff, every member of the team got a tertiary type added. For example if I had a Drampa with Tera Fairy and sent it out first, It would then be Normal/Dragon/Fairy, and my Breloom would be Grass/Fighting/Fairy, but my Flutter Mane would still only be regular Ghost/Fairy.
Or maybe Drampa's Tera works exactly like normal and it's mono-Fairy idk. You can't use my boi anyway ;-;7
The difference is between a super type-spammy hyper-offensive metagame where it is likely that teams will be focused on only one or two of the potential types are actually used at all because your team has them on everything, and a meta that has more flexibility with what types you choose, more ability to wrangle resistances as well as more STABs, and not being centralized around insane wallbreakers.
I agree with Kaen that adding Tera to team preview would be important, but that's something we wrangle after the fact.
Whether or not you take my advice about the tertiary typing I would like to see this in submissions. I think it's one of the best Tera submissions I've seen. I would be much more inclined to approve if you did take my feedback into account at least a bit though.
Premise:
Non-Status Moves from Types that existed in Gen 3 become Physical or Special depending on the category the Type used back then. Potentialthreats:
Not getting affected by the change is often a good thing, as you no longer have competition from stuff that got nerfed, this results in a series of metagames changes compared to OU.
The "I'm not sure if I want this" group:
Some physical Flying-types can now use Hurricane and Air Slash as their main STAB, a big upgrade from the nothing the non-birds had, but some like Dragonite and Gyarados now have to use their lower attacking stat for their other STAB. Dragapult get to use Shadow Ball on its physical sets but no Dragon Darts, so it may want to go mixed.
The "I don't like changes" group:
A lot of Pokémon hate returning to this as they are left without good STABs, you may find some of the Ubers no longer being all that impressive like Palafin who may give up on its STAB and go with Tera Boombusrt to be at least usable.
But what about Fairies???
The best way to answer this question is to ignore it, trying to decide in a category would be too arbitrary, as the logic Game Freak used back then is... weird? They made Dark Special despite all their moves being about physical contact, there isn't much to follow, and trying to use Eevee to decide this doesn't really work as not all Special types have an eeveelution. But more importantly, if gen 10+ decides to add a new Type, we will already have an answer, their moves aren't affected by the mechanic.
I've wanted this to be a good meta for a long time. But Fairies... always make it seem so sloppy and I hate that. You've described the best, objective way to deal with it though.
I wouldn't mind seeing this in submissions, but I wouldn't be optimistic about it being approved. We'd have to see what other mods thought about it.
As for the "Current gen with Old Gen mechanics" being bad thing I don't see that being an issue here. This is one mechanic, based in something objective. We would discuss this in submissions. I'm sure, but personally I don't have an issue.
Premise: The Type Chart is now thiscredit goes to the person who made this
Potential Threats: Fire types and Ghost types are very hard to get rid of now and Normal types can only hit both. Fire types and Ground types hit so many other types for supereffective damage, so they are something to watch out for offensively. Types such as Rock and Ghost are basically useless offensively.
Questions for Community:
Is this too unbalanced? Some types are way stronger than others,obviously. knowing gamefreak it seems like we are fine to an extent
Are there any pokemon, abilities, moves, or items that come to mind that should be banned?
Premise: A doubles based metagame where a pokemon's primary type is swapped with the ally's tera type.
Example/Mechanics: If you have Tera Electric Houndoom and Tera Water Lumineon, the Houndoom will be Water/Fire with Tera Water and the Lumineon will be pure Electric with Tera Dark.
Once terastalized, however, the Houndoom will ALWAYS be pure Water with STABs in Dark/Fire/Water and the Lumineon will stay as pure Electric with Tera Dark (which is now useless)
If a Quagsire with Tera Poison switches in the place of Lumineon, it will be Electric/Ground with Tera Dark.
If the same Quagsire switches in the place of Houndoom, the Quagsire will be Water/Ground Type with Tera Water and Lumineon will be Poison type with Tera Water.
Potential Bans: Pokemon: these are obvious. Clauses: Standard Doubles Clause
Strategy: Tera type does not need to be shown in team preview because with a little bit of thought, you can figure out the tera type of every pokemon, making you prepared for every situation.
You can pivot around as necessary to fit the needs at the given moment to gain a better type or a better tera type. Once you are in a good spot, you can terastalize as needed with up to six tera types at your disposal.
Giving a pokemon the same tera type as it's primary type can give an offensive boost to your ally once your ally terastalizes.
Some Possible Threats
It gets a wide variety of moves that it usually runs for coverage. It's strongest moves are quite weak and is has room for change.
Why does this get so much coverage? It has TONS of moves and can do very well physically and specially.
Maybe pair this with Tera Grass Torkoal for Solar Beam and Giga Drain nukes. It's Bug moves are quite lacking and a Grass/Fire type could be cool.
Protean? Change ally's tera type? You can do some super interesting and fun strategies.
Shed Tail is already insane, and combining this with a more defensive typing like Ghost/Normal could make this an absolute beast of a support. It also gets a couple good coverage moves if it wants to go offensive.
Questions for the Community
Is the premise too complicated? I wanted to do something with doubles, the new gimmick, and make try to make it balanced and unique.
Are there any pokemon, abilities, moves, or items that come to mind that should be banned?
This is more interesting than the first Type Swap version, but also seems super confusing.
I'm a little at a loss for which Doubles strategies specifically would be enhanced by this metagame's mechanics, to be frank. This metas building seems to rely on having the two right Pokemon together on the field at the same time, which in my experience isn't reliable in Doubles.
Am I missing strategies that are more universal? Swapping types that is advantageous within teams without it being
Teambuilding seems very difficult and rigorous without just spamming one tera type or generically good tera types (ooh look I'm Steel now I'm Fairy).
Also: Why swap the Tera type and the Primary type instead of override the Primary type? Not saying it has to go either way, just curious what your reasoning is.
I'm not a huge fan of this at first glance, but I'm not gonna instantly shoot it down. I haven't gone through all the feedback you've gotten yet, but I will, and I hope to see if some people who actually play Doubles have responded.
Premise: All four terrains are active at the same time permanently. This means all Electric, Grass, and Psychic moves get their power boosted by 30%, priority is unusable, you can't put anything to sleep, you get passive Leftovers, status doesn't work, Earthquake and Magnitude have their damage halved, and Dragon moves have their damage cut.
Potential Bans/Threats: The only Pokemon in the game with access to one of Expanding Force, Grassy Glide, or Rising Voltage. It really enjoys the passive healing that this meta provides, and it has a very strong Expanding Force. Additionally, it really appreciates the halving of Earthquake's damage. Double Leftovers? No Toxics? These are gonna be a nightmare. Better be packing an extremely strong Grass to handle them. Oh. Right. Quark Drive. Iron Hands, Iron Valiant, and Iron Moth will start out banned, but the rest of the future paradoxes will be constantly looked at to make sure they aren't broken. This meta will inherently be quite defensive, thanks to the lack of Toxic and passive Leftovers. Stall and semi-stall will be constantly looked at, and I could see even something as extreme as an Item Clause come into effect. This thing has been absolutely ruined. Its best STAB move is now Earth Power. Have fun with that.
Questions for the community:
Will this meta be too defensive? If so, what can be done to fix it?
Are there any issues with the core of the metagame on the coding side?
This did too poorly in the past frankly. It didn't come back because it wasn't popular, and we lost even more tools for terrain this generation. I would very much deny this, sorry.
In this metagame, you put a terrain/weather/condition instead of the item slot, and it stays up as long as the mon is in. If the two mons on the field have the same thing in the item slot, it cancels out. There can be two of the same type of conditions up at the same time (Example: Rain and hail can both be up). Magic room cancels out everything plus its normal purpose, and thats pretty much it I think.
Questions:
Anyone got a name idea? I've got no idea what to call it
Should types completely unaffected by all terrains/weathers get a stat boost?
Is it possible to code?
Gravity+Hypnosis/sing is prob too op so maybe sleep ban?
I agree with everything UT said. I'm gonna be blunt though, I don't think this idea is worth workshopping. We've had Acid Rain (all weather) and it wasn't popular. We had All Terrain (all terrains up) and it wasn't popular. We have Trademarked (which I'm sure will come back for Gen 9) and it is fairly popular, and a generally better version of this metagame. I hope you come up with some other ideas though :)
Heres my gen9 OM idea! Any pokemon can travel forward or back through time!
Metagame premise. Pokemon put a Paradox mon that they share a typing with as their name: if they do, they get that mon's highest 2 stats and access to their movepool!
(In the situation that mons top 2 stats tie across 3 stats (such as Flutter Mane), the priority is left to right. This meta grants Spa and Spdef in Flutter Mane's case.)
the paradox mons: all mons with Protosynthesis or Quark Drive as an ability. Doesnt include Miraidon and Koraidon
- Ground and Fighting types: 131 Atk, 131 Def - Fairy and Psychic types: 115 Hp, 115 SpD - Grass and Dark types: 111Hp, 127 Atk - Ghost and Fairy types:135 SpA, 135 SpD - Bug and Fighting types: 135 Atk, 105 SpD - Electric and Ground types: 121 SpA, 101 Spe - Dragon and Dark types: 139 Atk, 119 Spe
- Ground and Steel types: 112 Atk, 120 Def - Ice and Water types: 124 SpA, 136 Spe - Electric and Fighting types: 154 Hp, 140 Atk - Dark and Flying types: 122 SpA, 108 Spe - Fire and Poison types: 140 SpA, 110 SpD - Rock and Electric types: 134 Atk, 110 Def - Fairy and Fighting types: 130 Atk, 120 SpA
Potential bans and threats.
It'll be an OU metagame, so the 2 box legends and Flutter Mane etc are banned. But Flutter Mane/Iron Bundle can still be used as a name.
Potential ban: Brute Bonnet (name)- Ruination Pokemon all appreciate Spore- even Chi Yu can be a hassle despite it not gaining anything from the atk stat. This could be a real chore to answer, especially for Chi Yu and Chien Pao.
Annihilape- has some disgusting names like Iron Hands or Slither Wing- granting it monster stats or 50% recovery respectively. It could prove too much to deal with
Ability bans: Pure Power, Huge Power, Eviolite (and any other standard ability ban from stat swappng and inheriting metas)
Example:
Scream Tail (Indeedee) (M) @ Terrain Extender
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Psychic
- Stealth Rock
- Fire Blast
Scream Tail grants Indeedee 115 HP, and 115 Spdef. Whats more it gains access to a ton of useful moves like Boomburst, SR, Wish, Fire Blast etc. Now it can be a threatening terrain setter, wall, hazard setter and more! Other mons that might appreciate Scream Tails boosts include Dachsbun and Azumarill, both becoming monster checks/counters to Chi-Yu.
Great Tusk (Clodsire) @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 88 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Recover
- Toxic
- Knock Off
A monster all-purpose wall, Clod is sitting on newfound 131 Atk and Def stats and an amazing support movepool. Knock Off and Rapid Spin are big additions, and it also gains a bunch of useful physical attacks like Ice Spinner off of its huge Atk stat. Definitely customizable to any and all situations.
:xy/tauros-paldea-fire:
Iron Hands (Tauros-Paldea-Fire) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Drain Punch
- Raging Bull
- Will-O-Wisp
- Volt Switch
This is one of the options to survive Chien Pao with Roaring Moon's atk stat. An amazing spread of 154/140/105/30/70/100 with Intimidate barely has any flaws, and it can act as a good Intimidate pivot for sure.
Iron Valiant (Tinkaton) @ Life Orb
Ability: Mold Breaker
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Gigaton Hammer
- Play Rough
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
What were you saying about Unaware? Mold Breaker Tinkaton can obliterate walls like Clodsire with its nuclear damage Gigaton Hammer off of 130 Atk, threatening an ohko at +2 on a 130Hp 130Def wall fully invested... The meta is full of offensive threats, so beware!
Questions for the community.
-What are some busted mons to look out for?
-Its clear that names like Iron Hands and Brute Bonnet provides so much value that you could easily use them 2 or 3 times on a team. Do you agree that a Name Clause (only 1 of each name per team) would lead to better play?
-Can Paradox pokemon take the names of other Paradox pokemon eg Iron Hands (Iron Valiant)?
-Is there any value in allowing Ubers, but in a restricted manner (they cant be named anything else)?
First: no need to ban Brute Bonnet if you implement Sleep Moves Clause ;) which we pretty much always recommend
Second: I feel like there's a really cool concept here. I also think the concept could be simplified, in several ways actually, and these ways might open up the metagame.
The typing mechanic. What does it add? As far as I can see it limits certain types immensely (Normal, Rock for example) while others get huge boosts (Fairy, Ground). This is rather unfair, and will tilt the metagame towards using the types that get better boosts. So why not just let any typed Pokemon use any booster? Is there a particular reason you chose this?
Why Paradox mons in particular? Besides being a convenient grouping of Pokemon, is there a reason to limit the Pokemon in this way? What would the meta be like if any Pokemon could donate (besides needing more restrictions of course lol Blissey).
This third one isn't so much a simplification as... I don't like the movepool donation. That's straight out of Inheritance, whereas this is sort of the reverse of Inheritance, albeit the original concept hides that pretty well with the typing mechanic and limiting it to Paradox mons.
I really like this and I would urge you to submit it. I did see people giving you feedback on the funtionality of the banlist, and we would definitely have to sort that out in submissions, but that's not a big issue.
I did not get up to date with this post. I will get through everything eventually though
This is more interesting than the first Type Swap version, but also seems super confusing.
I'm a little at a loss for which Doubles strategies specifically would be enhanced by this metagame's mechanics, to be frank. This metas building seems to rely on having the two right Pokemon together on the field at the same time, which in my experience isn't reliable in Doubles.
Am I missing strategies that are more universal? Swapping types that is advantageous within teams without it being
Teambuilding seems very difficult and rigorous without just spamming one tera type or generically good tera types (ooh look I'm Steel now I'm Fairy).
Also: Why swap the Tera type and the Primary type instead of override the Primary type? Not saying it has to go either way, just curious what your reasoning is.
I'm not a huge fan of this at first glance, but I'm not gonna instantly shoot it down. I haven't gone through all the feedback you've gotten yet, but I will, and I hope to see if some people who actually play Doubles have responded.
My reasoning behind this was we kinda need some sort of tera type OM cause there is a whole ton of room for creativity.
I tried to incorporate it with doubles and my previous ideas.
I’ll keep spewing out doubles OM ideas until something really good sparks. Swapping just regular primary types could be cool, but I don’t want to look desperate trying to submit the same thing, just revised. Maybe later.
I had another shower thought where its normal doubles but if both mons click their first move, or both click second move, etc., blah occurs. It’s not completely finished idek what blah means. I’ll come up with something, that hopefully includes the new terastal gimmick.
'Max inheritance' (name needs work maybe something gift)
So in this metagame, it's like godly gift, except you don't have a 'god' on the team and its the best Stat of each Mon's first type. For example, a Dragon type in the speed slot would get pults speed.
Banlist: the box Art Legends, maybe flutter mane since only 2 stats are bad and blims HP makes it crazy
Questions for community: any other mons that should be on the banlist or donor banlist
This strikes me as a less interactive version of Godly Gift. Instead of being able to switch up which stats a Pokemon gets its based on a rather luck-based system... and essentially we're just looking at one possibility in each slot. I think this is too similar to one of our most popular metagames to fly as it stands on the table. Perhaps some other method of choosing which stat is donated?
Type Power (Name needs work most likely but still)
Concept: Every type gets an additional ability based (loosely) on thier typing on top of their og ability.
Ability list:
Normal: Scrappy
Fire: Protosynthesis
Grass: Thick Fat
Water: Fluffy
Electric: Quark Drive
Fighting: Tough Claws
Flying: Gale Wings
Poison: Corrosion
Ghost: Prankster
Dark: Dark Aura
Fairy: Fairy Aura
Ice: Mountaineer (ik it's a cap ability but still)
Ground: Purifying Salt
Steel: Steely Spirit
Rock:Solid Rock
Psychic: Dazzling
Dragon: Adaptability
Bug: Tinted lens
For example: Donbozo here now has unaware and fluffy to wall any set up sweeper that use contact moves Gengar here not only has it's Cursed Body (which is still bad) but also has Prankster and Corrosion for toxic stall
Potential Threats:
Now you don't need Bite/Thief to hit ghost and it gets Low Kick to hit Rock/Steel Types
Proto and Aura (If I don't change it) are really powerful and on an already powerful Mon, need I say more.
These guys man, on top of having Tinted Lens they have secondary types that help them get in/kill things and their base abilities
Otherwise I'm open to any changes to any of the abilities if you think something would fit better (which something probably would), also tera would be banned if you were wondering.
This would qualify as a Pet Mod I'm afraid. There's nothing objective about the list selected, and it would have to follow a single, mechanically quantifiable rule. You might want to look at Metagamiate, which gave an appropriate -ate to each Pokemon (and gave them weird names but that wasn't really important lol). However my feeling is that it's been largely replaced by Revelationmons. https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/metagamiate.3604808/
Concept: Immediately after using a move, the opponent uses the same move, if possible. Similar to how the ability Dancer uses a Dance move immediately after someone on the field does, now every move used forces the opponent to follow up and do the same thing.
Possible Bans: At the moment all moves currently in the game are "legal", moves will likely be added to the Restricted Moves section below. Obligatory "Koraidon and Miraidon are banned." Moody, probably Trapping Abilities (Arena Trap, Shadow Tag)
Unrepeated Moves: (Edit: these moves will not be repeated by the opponent) Trick Room(?), Pivot Moves (Volt Switch/U-Turn/Flip Turn), Outrage, Focus Punch, Protection Moves (all moves listed here)
Strategies: (Edited to use the wording in my later post)
A Pokemon uses a move. The opponent will then use the same move. This does not occur when one of the below conditions occurs:
1) The move is on the "do not repeat" list (the Unrepeated Moves listed above)
2) The move has no affect on the target (the Pokemon's typing or ability giving an immunity, or being blocked by an active effect, such as terrain or Magic Bounce)
3) For whatever reason, the move fails (a condition is not met, like First Impression or Steel Roller, for example)
4) The Pokemon who used the move faints before the opponent gets to repeat it (whether this be from recoil or Life Orb damage, or whether this is a self-sacrificing move)
If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.
In that same vein, being immune to a move you know because of your typing is also good for you.
Want someone to hit you with just the right move to trigger your ability, or do a low amount of damage to improve your damage on a signature move? Pick a low damage move that your opponent can use to your benefit.
Be careful, set-up sweepers! Oricorio could use your dance moves before, but now anyone can too! Maybe boosting moves aren't the safest option to choose!
If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!
Certain moves have conditions that would prevent the opponent from following up with the same move. Sucker Punch fails if your opponent moves before you, and First Impression only works during the Pokemon's first turn on the field. If played well, these moves can be used safely without issue.
Be smart with how you use your status conditions and reap the benefits accordingly.
Edited so it doesn't take up half the page, edited again after some more thought went into the concept. Edited a third time because I realized I hadn't considered the existence of Protect.
This is a very unique idea. I genuinely don't know what to make of it honestly. I would like to see this submitted so we can try it out, because I don't know what to expect.
Your unrepeated moves list is a little odd to my eye. I see no reason to put Trick Room on it. Yes, it means Trick Room gets undone, but that's a casualty of the metagame, and we shouldn't bend the rules to buff / enable a playstyle.
Some moves that actually mess with the mechanics should go on that list (Encore and stuff like that), not stuff that effects the metagame negatively. You would ban that stuff if you find it overwhelming, or deal with it not existing in the case of Trick Room.
Tool Swap (WIP)
Metagame premise: You can take any ability you want, as long a Pokémon with this ability has your movepool! The purpose is to make something similar to AAA, but with more links between mons. Also to see funny relations between movepools. It would work like inheritance, but you can’t use illegals moves.
Functionement:
Alohomora (Scream Tail) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Play Rough
- Wish
- Protect
- Light Screen
So, all of Scream Tail’s moves are also obtainable on another Pokémon, in this case the one we are interested in is Alomomola. Scream Tail is allowed to take Alomomolas Abilities. It could also take Pixilated, Static, Cute Charm, Competitive, Hydration, Healer and Lighting Rod. Meta would be a lot based on scouting I guess, with a lot of Stall as all stalkers are the same. On the other hand, Mold Breaker could be the path to freedom.
Potential bans and threats: Broken AAA stuff.
Huge/Pure Power are obviously broken, especially Pure Power since its movepool is wide enough. Iron Hands especially can run a classic set.
Iron Hands @ Punching Glove
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Ice Punch
- Thunder Punch
- Close Combat
Poison Heal may be OP, but I doubt it, maybe some would like to run ToxicSubSeed.
Stakeout’s without a doubt broken, Roaring Moon can run a Band set with a normal movepool.
Comatose is probably fine, as Komala hasn’t Rose.
Questions for the community:
Other bannable things? Should inheriting from NDex/Unreleased be allowed?
Please don't repost your ideas. It can take a little while for us to respond, so be patient. As I said in my other post, this is too similar to Inheritance and I would not approve it.
Metagame Premise: Players numerically apply the concepts of mixed strategies and risk vs reward.
Players play normally until a turn where one player does more damage, or one player makes a move and the other switches or does nothing (due to taunt or other things). Starting with the player with the "advantage" last turn, this turn he must allocate a percentage chance to each switch he could make, and this is revealed to the opponent. Then the opponent chooses their move. We use a random number from 1 to 100 to determine the first player's move. We alternate who shows their hand every turn. So if it's Player A's turn to show first, and it's his Slowking-Galar against a specs Lele, he might do:
Stay In: 30%
Switch to Ferrothorn: 40%
Switch to Mandibuzz: 30%
I am 90% sure this isn't something we can code, which is an instant disqualification.
Additionally adding more RNG lowers the amount of human skill involved in the game, which is contrary to our goal competitively. I do not see this as a good idea overall. But point 1 is more important.
I am stealing an idea from SpiderKoloPL, sorry for not asking
Pocket Moves
The idea behind this new Metagame is very simple:
Each Pokemon have access to normal 4 moves with their normal pp amounts... no tweaks to abilities, just standard OU format for the most part...
And then there is a twist: Each Pokemon have also have access to fifth (5th) move with just a single pp use.
The so called Pocket Move, stored in there just in case for that one special occasion which otherwise would not be used in any normal circumstance.
It would still have to come from Pokemon normal movepool - we are not introducing new moves into Pokemons movepool like in STABmons.
I heard that Pokemon as a game was balanced and designed with each pokemon having only 4 moves in mind and that giving them more would lead to less interesting metagames... And if we were to just allow having five moves with no restrictions attached to it? That might have been the case...
What this metagame is trying to achieve is to answer the question:
Could fifth move with even just a single use break the game?
Every Pokemon have access to their Pocket move of choice (from their movepool) in fifth slot. You have to insert it manually in Import/Export section and at the moment there is no other elegant way of doing that...
I'm not aware of any other similar suggestion from this Thread... But also I was not looking through (at the time of writing) 57 pages filled to the brim with post of other users mixed with feedback.
If there were any ideas like this - I will link those in this post, just please let me know.
Here are few examples of movesets utilizing those new Pocket slots:
Dondozo @ Leftovers
-Waterfall
-Rest
-Curse
-Sleep Talk
-Earthquake
Here, EQ would allow to beat Clodsire in an emergency case
Annihilape @ Leftovers
-Rage Fist
-Drain Punch
-Taunt
-Bulk Up
-Rest
Another emergency button to save a sweep
Hatterenne @ Keftovets
-Calm Mind
-Draining Kiss
-Psyshock
-Mystical Fire
-Healing Wish
This move doesn’t suffer from having 1 PP.
I hope you like the idea for Metagame!
We had a 6 move metagame once upon a time. It didn't do very well because for each moveslot you add the value of it goes down. What I mean by that is that with your first moveslot you're going to add the most valuable possible move. Naturally. Second and third you'll add your second and third most valuable moves, and fourth... you can see where I'm going. So adding more moveslots means you're picking moves you need less than what you added before. And more than 4 moveslots honestly doesn't make a huge difference for most Pokemon.
If these moves were nerfed further by only having 1 PP I can't see this being very different at all from OU honestly.
This strikes me as a less interactive version of Godly Gift. Instead of being able to switch up which stats a Pokemon gets its based on a rather luck-based system... and essentially we're just looking at one possibility in each slot. I think this is too similar to one of our most popular metagames to fly as it stands on the table. Perhaps some other method of choosing which stat is donated?
What if you put the pokemon you want to be the donor as the nickname and then you get the type(s) of the donor with the stat? would that make it different enough?
What if you put the pokemon you want to be the donor as the nickname and then you get the type(s) of the donor with the stat? would that make it different enough?
So, like, you name your slot 5 Great Tusk Palkia and it gets 120 spdef and Water/Dragon? Seems interesting. There are some cool trade-offs involved where you could take lower stats for a better typing or vice versa.
This is another Inheritance though.
So, like, you name your slot 5 Great Tusk Palkia and it gets 120 spdef and Water/Dragon? Seems interesting. There are some cool trade-offs involved where you could take lower stats for a better typing or vice versa.
This is another Inheritance though.
While it sounds like Inh as in "taking from someone else" it has the key difference of taking the attributes not used by Inh, so unlike stuff that has been already rejected, it doesn't end with similar sets.
I am 90% sure this isn't something we can code, which is an instant disqualification.
Additionally adding more RNG lowers the amount of human skill involved in the game, which is contrary to our goal competitively. I do not see this as a good idea overall. But point 1 is more important.
This is how an optimized computer would play the game. If it uses pure deterministic strategies and opponent knows its strategies, they can just pick a move that counters it. By using pseudorandom strategies, it takes advantage of the opponent guessing wrong.
Let's say you were to play the same opponent for the 100th time. If you make the same plays in the same situation every time, they can catch on. Even playing according to a pattern would be caught by computers with good pattern detection. You would need to adopt randomized strategies. An optimized computer is uncounterable no matter how many times you play it.
So, like, you name your slot 5 Great Tusk Palkia and it gets 120 spdef and Water/Dragon? Seems interesting. There are some cool trade-offs involved where you could take lower stats for a better typing or vice versa.
This is another Inheritance though.
This is how an optimized computer would play the game. If it uses pure deterministic strategies and opponent knows its strategies, they can just pick a move that counters it. By using pseudorandom strategies, it takes advantage of the opponent guessing wrong.
We don't want a meta that runs like an optimized computer. We want metas where the humans involved analyze the situation and make the call. More human interaction is always better than less.
I don't think this idea has much of a future as is unfortunately. A metagame that involves giving more information in terms of percentages might be interesting, but I'm not sure how that could be implemented.
I spoke to Instruct, one of our main OM coders, about this and apparently it is theoretically codable. But it would be a huge project, and would inevitably fall into what was referred to as "code death".
If it's not going to get coded then there's no point to having the metagame.
What if you put the pokemon you want to be the donor as the nickname and then you get the type(s) of the donor with the stat? would that make it different enough?
Premise: Choose a type such that a pokemon’s moves of that type get replaced by another type and gain a 1.2x boost. It’s like generalized -ate abilities. now this is quite vague, gimme a second My Execution: The type of move that gets replaced is your tera type, and the type it gets replaced into is the type corresponding to the plate it holds. Example: Tera Fire Luxray with Earth Plate makes it’s fire type moves turn into ground type, and therefore gain a 1.2x bonus from the item. which is only fire fang shut up lol Why did I do what I did?: Look in my questions for community.
Potential Bans:
Pokemon: these are obvious. Maybe some other stuff that can take stupidly high advantage of the mechanic. Abilities: -ate abilities lol. Stacking with the already glorified -ate ability mechanic, it would be too much. Clauses: Standard Singles Clause, Terastal Clause. Combining terastalization with already changing move types and boosting them is too far.
Some Theorymoning:im terrible at outlining specific pokemon so from now on its general strategies
Stuff like Noivern was banned from AAA last gen cause of aboosing Aerilate with strong normal type moves such as Boomburst. Now any pokemon with strong enough moves can aboose this mechanic as much as they like.
These moves can get even stronger with STAB by making the move type turn into one they already have. They can even boost their own type moves without changing the move type.
Defensive pokemon here take a big hit because they can’t wall or check certain pokemon effectively now due to an extra type that they can use effectively.
It’s not quite a third STAB, but it also is isn’t completely useless, and it gives justification to sacrificing your item/tera slot. You can still run items if you want, and it could be viable for pokemon that don’t need, or receive anything, from the mechanic, but it keeps it balanced.
Questions for the Community:
This was my method of somehow taking two attributes of a pokemon, such that it signifies two types to make it user friendly as possible and without making it pet moddy. Is there any other way of accomplishing the premise?
Does the power level feel too huge? You are sacrificing an item/tera slot so it seems balanced in my head.
What’s a better name for this? Infinate came from combining infinity (cause there are “infinite” combinations) and -ate to signify where the idea came from. It doesn’t really roll of the tongue, though.
Are there any pokemon, abilities, moves, or items that come to mind that should be banned?
I agree, but I think I'm gonna get rid of the primary type based idea and so you can pick any type for your Mon to be. In some (probably most) situations you can pick a Mon with the same type but you could also have a whole nother type and have the Mon fill a different role
We don't want a meta that runs like an optimized computer. We want metas where the humans involved analyze the situation and make the call. More human interaction is always better than less.
What do you mean by "we"? Chess engines exist and dominate, and people learn from them. In any case, Pokemon engines at top level don't exist. But this is for an OM, not for a main tier, so we can be flexible with how it works. Human analysis exists by fine tuning the percentages for the randomized strategies.
I don't think this idea has much of a future as is unfortunately. A metagame that involves giving more information in terms of percentages might be interesting, but I'm not sure how that could be implemented.
I spoke to Instruct, one of our main OM coders, about this and apparently it is theoretically codable. But it would be a huge project, and would inevitably fall into what was referred to as "code death".
If it's not going to get coded then there's no point to having the metagame.
Have a text field for every switch, enter the percentage chance for each switch in those boxes. If they total less than 100, you must choose a move. If they total 100, a button called Switch becomes clickable and you click it. The percentages are revealed in the chat. The opponent then chooses their move, and then a random number from 1-100 is chosen to select your move.
Have a text field for every switch, enter the percentage chance for each switch in those boxes. If they total less than 100, you must choose a move. If they total 100, a button called Switch becomes clickable and you click it. The percentages are revealed in the chat. The opponent then chooses their move, and then a random number from 1-100 is chosen to select your move.
This is a complete overhaul to the client, and is a non-starter. Sure, it’s obviously technically possible to code, but that’s a huge amount of effort for our devs for a small project.
This idea would be rejected as an OM submission. If you want to work on another idea, please feel free! But there is no point in continuing this one.
I haven't read all the feedback you've gotten, but I like this overall. However I think it would be better if, instead of just being an offensive buff, every member of the team got a tertiary type added. For example if I had a Drampa with Tera Fairy and sent it out first, It would then be Normal/Dragon/Fairy, and my Breloom would be Grass/Fighting/Fairy, but my Flutter Mane would still only be regular Ghost/Fairy.
Or maybe Drampa's Tera works exactly like normal and it's mono-Fairy idk. You can't use my boi anyway ;-;7
The difference is between a super type-spammy hyper-offensive metagame where it is likely that teams will be focused on only one or two of the potential types are actually used at all because your team has them on everything, and a meta that has more flexibility with what types you choose, more ability to wrangle resistances as well as more STABs, and not being centralized around insane wallbreakers.
I agree with Kaen that adding Tera to team preview would be important, but that's something we wrangle after the fact.
Whether or not you take my advice about the tertiary typing I would like to see this in submissions. I think it's one of the best Tera submissions I've seen. I would be much more inclined to approve if you did take my feedback into account at least a bit though.
I am definitely okay with this version. The terastylizing Pokemon changing type turn one and giving the type as a bonus to the rest of the team does seem like it would be really interesting. I would have to go back and look at this and reconsider a banlist but I am glad to see a number of people liking the concept.
Edited to mention Kaen's post regarding possibly changing the primary type of all Pokemon in the party. Not sure if this would be better. I do know that the other method, giving them a third type, might step on the toes of the Bonus Type people.
Your unrepeated moves list is a little odd to my eye. I see no reason to put Trick Room on it. Yes, it means Trick Room gets undone, but that's a casualty of the metagame, and we shouldn't bend the rules to buff / enable a playstyle.
Some moves that actually mess with the mechanics should go on that list (Encore and stuff like that), not stuff that effects the metagame negatively. You would ban that stuff if you find it overwhelming, or deal with it not existing in the case of Trick Room.
The Trick Room point is fair. I had considered the "oh no people are pointing out a move that is now useless to use" but it might be for the best that this is the case. As for the Encore point, I hope that the coding would invalidate that being necessary. If the reaction attack applies the way that the ability Dancer triggers (which I was more or less using as my baseline for this concept), then in theory the repeating move should ignore Encore, Torment, or Taunt (I have not tested this, Oricorio fans feel free to tell me if I am mistaken). Instead, just like with other moves, they would be bounced back at the user, making that an unsafe strategy to try. I will definitely update my list to remove Trick Room, and see what other cases could prove to be required exceptions, such as the earlier conversation regarding Outrage.
Second edit to say that both metas could probably use a name change. Share-a-Type was a pun on the fact I was co-opting an earlier post's "Tera-Typing" name. Any advice on what a better name for that would be much appreciated. Repeat After Me is probably fine as a name, but I am also considering something like "Follow the Leader" or "Stop Copying Me"
It’s not compatible with the PS! framework and would require a complete overhaul. Is that “codeable”? Sure. Are we going to do that? No.
This is a complete overhaul to the client, and is a non-starter. Sure, it’s obviously technically possible to code, but that’s a huge amount of effort for our devs for a small project.
This idea would be rejected as an OM submission. If you want to work on another idea, please feel free! But there is no point in continuing this one.
Premise: Choose a type such that a pokemon’s moves of that type get replaced by another type and gain a 1.2x boost. It’s like generalized -ate abilities. now this is quite vague, gimme a second My Execution: The type of move that gets replaced is your tera type, and the type it gets replaced into is the type corresponding to the plate it holds. Example: Tera Fire Luxray with Earth Plate makes it’s fire type moves turn into ground type, and therefore gain a 1.2x bonus from the item. which is only fire fang shut up lol Why did I do what I did?: Look in my questions for community.
Potential Bans:
Pokemon: these are obvious. Maybe some other stuff that can take stupidly high advantage of the mechanic. Abilities: -ate abilities lol. Stacking with the already glorified -ate ability mechanic, it would be too much. Clauses: Standard Singles Clause, Terastal Clause. Combining terastalization with already changing move types and boosting them is too far.
Some Theorymoning:im terrible at outlining specific pokemon so from now on its general strategies
Stuff like Noivern was banned from AAA last gen cause of aboosing Aerilate with strong normal type moves such as Boomburst. Now any pokemon with strong enough moves can aboose this mechanic as much as they like.
These moves can get even stronger with STAB by making the move type turn into one they already have. They can even boost their own type moves without changing the move type.
Defensive pokemon here take a big hit because they can’t wall or check certain pokemon effectively now due to an extra type that they can use effectively.
It’s not quite a third STAB, but it also is isn’t completely useless, and it gives justification to sacrificing your item/tera slot. You can still run items if you want, and it could be viable for pokemon that don’t need, or receive anything, from the mechanic, but it keeps it balanced.
Questions for the Community:
This was my method of somehow taking two attributes of a pokemon, such that it signifies two types to make it user friendly as possible and without making it pet moddy. Is there any other way of accomplishing the premise?
Does the power level feel too huge? You are sacrificing an item/tera slot so it seems balanced in my head.
What’s a better name for this? Infinate came from combining infinity (cause there are “infinite” combinations) and -ate to signify where the idea came from. It doesn’t really roll of the tongue, though.
Are there any pokemon, abilities, moves, or items that come to mind that should be banned?
I think if it just looks at the type of move in your first slot (or last slot if you wanted, but we usually use first) and then it can turn into the Tera or Plate type. Preferably Tera because the plates aren't actually released.
I am definitely okay with this version. The terastylizing Pokemon changing type turn one and giving the type as a bonus to the rest of the team does seem like it would be really interesting. I would have to go back and look at this and reconsider a banlist but I am glad to see a number of people liking the concept.
Edited to mention Kaen's post regarding possibly changing the primary type of all Pokemon in the party. Not sure if this would be better. I do know that the other method, giving them a third type, might step on the toes of the Bonus Type people.
The Trick Room point is fair. I had considered the "oh no people are pointing out a move that is now useless to use" but it might be for the best that this is the case. As for the Encore point, I hope that the coding would invalidate that being necessary. If the reaction attack applies the way that the ability Dancer triggers (which I was more or less using as my baseline for this concept), then in theory the repeating move should ignore Encore, Torment, or Taunt (I have not tested this, Oricorio fans feel free to tell me if I am mistaken). Instead, just like with other moves, they would be bounced back at the user, making that an unsafe strategy to try. I will definitely update my list to remove Trick Room, and see what other cases could prove to be required exceptions, such as the earlier conversation regarding Outrage.
I think these mechanical things are all that really need to be ironed out, and I look forward to seeing this as a submission :)
I missed your edit the first time :o
Follow the Leader is a different, older OM. Repeat After Me sounds fine to me. But I'm bad at names and tired rn so don't trust my judgement.
As a programmer, I don't know why the framework isn't flexible enough that this would be too much work.
Can you address the following point?
Like why you wouldn't want a metagame to run like an optimized computer when this is clearly the case in Chess where engine strategies dominate.
We don't want a meta that runs like an optimized computer. We want metas where the humans involved analyze the situation and make the call. More human interaction is always better than less.
Chess engines exist and dominate, and people learn from them. In any case, Pokemon engines at top level don't exist. But this is for an OM, not for a main tier, so we can be flexible with how it works. Human analysis exists by fine tuning the percentages for the randomized strategies.
As a programmer, I don't know why the framework isn't flexible enough that this would be too much work.
Can you address the following point?
Like why you wouldn't want a metagame to run like an optimized computer when this is clearly the case in Chess where engine strategies dominate.
If you are successfully able to get this working, with probably some restrictions that I do not know of, then you can hit up the rest of the OM approval team and show your work.
The next part comes, after you put all of this effort and the OM approval team accept this by some miracle, would people actually play it? I personally don’t want a random number generator making decisions for me because I feel like I am capable of playing the game myself. How would this affect the teambuilding side of things? It’s just standard OU.
Other OMs have such exciting mechanics and interesting teambuilding strategies that make it appealing and fun for a decent chunk of the OM enjoyers and playerbase. What does this have that makes it different?
You can’t compare chess engines to pokemon battle engines. In a pokemon game, the engines are quite trash and easily predictable. In chess, these engines are also predictable, but have advanced humans. Why? Because chess has been around for thousands of years and has a huge playerbase compared to pokemon. Pokemon has been around for less than 30 years. Nobody is going to code something up that, for example, searches through the first 10 optimal moves in a pokemon battling game, because it’s a kids game taken too seriously you can’t define an “optimal” move.
Chess is a turn based game where you are able to respond to your opponent. Your opponent has to, in turn, react back and come up with a plan with the logical moves you make. This lets you create an optimal response to whatever your opponent does. Pokemon is a prediction game, each turn both players make a move, trying to predict each other. Pokemon is like massive rock, paper, scissors, mashed with the RNG to make a whole, different type, of mess from chess. These games are not comparable, nor comparable to RPS.
I don’t want want to sound rude or harsh, but it is the truth in my humble and honest opinion.
You can’t compare chess engines to pokemon battle engines. In a pokemon game, the engines are quite trash and easily predictable. In chess, these engines are also predictable, but have advanced humans. Why? Because chess has been around for thousands of years and has a huge playerbase compared to pokemon. Pokemon has been around for less than 30 years. Nobody is going to code something up that, for example, searches through the first 10 optimal moves in a pokemon battling game, because it’s a kids game taken too seriously you can’t define an “optimal” move.
Chess is a turn based game where you are able to respond to your opponent. Your opponent has to, in turn, react back and come up with a plan with the logical moves you make. This lets you create an optimal response to whatever your opponent does. Pokemon is a prediction game, each turn both players make a move, trying to predict each other. Pokemon is like massive rock, paper, scissors, mashed with the RNG to make a whole, different type, of mess from chess. These games are not comparable, nor comparable to RPS.
I don’t want want to sound rude or harsh, but it is the truth in my humble and honest opinion.
I gave several links, including https://math.stackexchange.com/ques...or-rock-paper-scissors-with-different-rewards that show how you calculate optimal percentages for your moves in a simultaneous game. The percentages maximize your expected utility assuming your opponent is also playing optimally. Being able to estimate the optimal probabilities in a complex game is obviously difficult and takes skill.
I asked why the mods who responded don't want a metagame where players play like an engine, when people accept that engines dominate in other games like chess. I did not say that Pokemon engines currently are advanced or that they will play like chess engines. You mentioned how the engines would work differently, not why you wouldn’t want engine-like gameplay in the first place.
I'm not pushing for this OM idea. The question I asked about optimized computers playing Pokemon is not limited to this OM idea.
As a programmer, I don't know why the framework isn't flexible enough that this would be too much work.
Can you address the following point?
Like why you wouldn't want a metagame to run like an optimized computer when this is clearly the case in Chess where engine strategies dominate.
Because the point of OMs are to create interesting playexperiences for the community. I get why you'd wanna see an optimized pokemon engine. It's fascinating to see computers beat the best players at a particular game and the ins and outs of how that works. But an OM that functions like an engine won't replicate that at all. The majority of the playerbase already weighs the different moves their opponent might make and then chooses their move based on that. Your meta would ask a player to skip the decision-making, arguably the most fun part of a pokemon game, and input the odds they think are optimal into the client. The player can no longer have the satisfaction of "making the correct read." The game will randomly decide what of its options to pick. You might not see it as a RNG-infested metagame, but I'm certain that the majority of the playerbase would raise their eyebrows at this suggestion. The few reactions you've had already should've made that clear. Even if this would be playable, I think many players, myself included, would be a little confused as to how to play optimally and would resort to one of 2 strategies: always give 1 option 100% chance or give all logical options an equal chance. Perhaps some players would learn about those theories you've posted and they would be more succesful. But in the end this meta is just OU with less (perceived) player agency in exchange for more (perceived) randomness. There is little demand for a metagame based around such a fundamentally different skillset. Most, if not all, OMs that thrive, do so because they shake up the game in a fun and novel way while maintaining the core concept of "competitive pokemon." So in my opinion, this isn't a solid base for a succesful OM.
I can't speak for Zarel and the many other programmers that've kept Showdown running for the past like 10 years, but this is just how it is. Showdown is a free webapplication that is the result of dozens of people spending their free time creating this for the community. Some things just require too many resources to be feasible. Historically major client updates like what you suggest here belong to that category.
But I do agree, a pokemon engine would be cool. If you really want to make this a thing, then you can (and absolutely should) try it yourself like prunyy suggested. Perhaps you could look into building and optimizing your own engine! If you can pull it off, then you can probably look into making a community around an engine-like metagame. With a working pokemon engine backing that up I have no doubt that it would garner attention. But for now I doubt this could be succesful in the context of the OM subforum.
Splitless 
these are obvious. 
Maybe pair this with Tera Grass Torkoal for Solar Beam and Giga Drain nukes. It's Bug moves are quite lacking and a Grass/Fire type could be cool.
Shed Tail is already insane, and combining this with a more defensive typing like Ghost/Normal could make this an absolute beast of a support. It also gets a couple good coverage moves if it wants to go offensive.
The only Pokemon in the game with access to one of Expanding Force, Grassy Glide, or Rising Voltage. It really enjoys the passive healing that this meta provides, and it has a very strong Expanding Force. Additionally, it really appreciates the halving of Earthquake's damage.
Double Leftovers? No Toxics? These are gonna be a nightmare. Better be packing an extremely strong Grass to handle them.
This thing has been absolutely ruined. Its best STAB move is now Earth Power. Have fun with that.
- Fairy and Psychic types: 115 Hp, 115 SpD
- Grass and Dark types: 111Hp, 127 Atk
- Bug and Fighting types: 135 Atk, 105 SpD
- Electric and Ground types: 121 SpA, 101 Spe
- Ground and Steel types: 112 Atk, 120 Def
- Ice and Water types: 124 SpA, 136 Spe
- Dark and Flying types: 122 SpA, 108 Spe
- Fire and Poison types: 140 SpA, 110 SpD
- Rock and Electric types: 134 Atk, 110 Def
Type Power 
Now you don't need Bite/Thief to hit ghost and it gets Low Kick to hit Rock/Steel Types
Proto and Aura (If I don't change it) are really powerful and on an already powerful Mon, need I say more.
Repeat After Me 
If a Pokemon has an ability that makes it immune to a type of move that it learns, it can safely use it and reap the benefits of it then being used by the opponent.
If you can force your opponent to flinch, they can't follow up and do your move, or theirs if you moved first. Just be careful that they don't flinch you instead!
Be smart with how you use your status conditions and reap the benefits accordingly.
Noivern was banned from AAA last gen cause of aboosing Aerilate with strong normal type moves such as Boomburst. Now any pokemon with strong enough moves can aboose this mechanic as much as they like.
