Metagame Workshop

[Scoopapa]

Here's a quick idea. It's based on two rules, so hopefully it's not too convoluted to be an OM.
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Dual-type inversion

-Monotype pokemon gain an additional type based on the first move in their moveset.

-Dual-type pokemon lose their secondary type and the first move in their moveset is changed to match their main type.

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The two rules are essentially inversions of each other, so hopefully their "symmetry" simplifies the concept.

Dual-type pokemon can lose their main type instead if the first move in their moveset matches their main type. The move will be retyped to their secondary type. For example, Stakataka (Rock/Steel) can turn itself along with any move in the first slot into a Rock type. However if the move in the first slot is a Rock-type move, Stakataka and the Rock-type move become Steel-type.

Some examples:

Manaphy @ Waterium Z
Water ----> Water/Fairy
252 SpA / 252 Spe, Timid
-Dazzling Gleam ( adds Fairy type )
-Hydro Pump
-Energy Ball
-Tail Glow

Tornadus:
Flying ----> Flying/Fighting
252 Atk / 252 Spe, Jolly
-Superpower ( adds Fighting type )
-Acrobatics
-Knock Off / Taunt / U-turn
-Bulk Up

Noivern @ Choice Specs
Flying / Dragon ----> Flying
252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Boomburst ( becomes Flying-type. Luckily no -ate boost )
-Flamethrower
-Focus Blast
-U-turn

Stakataka @ Leftovers
Rock / Steel ----> Steel
252 HP / 252 Atk, Adamant
-Stealth Rock ( This matches Stakataka 's main type, Rock, so Stakataka will become Steel type and Stealth Rock a Steel-type move )
-Gyro Ball
-Earthquake
-Trick Room

I think this would make for an interesting shakeup. It's clear that adding a new type is more likely to buff a pokemon than taking one away in exchange for a retyped move; however the majority of monotype pokemon are in lower tiers, and the majority of OU pokemon have great dual-types, hopefully resulting in a big tier shift and lots of interesting opportunities. Of course, the type removal option will still create some strong sets, but they may be more of a puzzle to find.

 

[Gojiratar]

Here's a quick idea. It's based on two rules, so hopefully it's not too convoluted to be an OM.
---------------------------------------------
Dual-type inversion

-Monotype pokemon gain an additional type based on the first move in their moveset.

-Dual-type pokemon lose their secondary type and the first move in their moveset is changed to match their main type.

---------------------------------------------

The two rules are essentially inversions of each other, so hopefully their "symmetry" simplifies the concept.

Dual-type pokemon can lose their main type instead if the first move in their moveset matches their main type. The move will be retyped to their secondary type. For example, Stakataka (Rock/Steel) can turn itself along with any move in the first slot into a Rock type. However if the move in the first slot is a Rock-type move, Stakataka and the Rock-type move become Steel-type.

Some examples:

Manaphy @ Waterium Z
Water ----> Water/Fairy
252 SpA / 252 Spe, Timid
-Dazzling Gleam ( adds Fairy type )
-Hydro Pump
-Energy Ball
-Tail Glow

Tornadus:
Flying ----> Flying/Fighting
252 Atk / 252 Spe, Jolly
-Superpower ( adds Fighting type )
-Acrobatics
-Knock Off / Taunt / U-turn
-Bulk Up

Noivern @ Choice Specs
Flying / Dragon ----> Flying
252 SpA / 252 Spe
-Boomburst ( becomes Flying-type. Luckily no -ate boost )
-Flamethrower
-Focus Blast
-U-turn

Stakataka @ Leftovers
Rock / Steel ----> Steel
252 HP / 252 Atk, Adamant
-Stealth Rock ( This matches Stakataka 's main type, Rock, so Stakataka will become Steel type and Stealth Rock a Steel-type move )
-Gyro Ball
-Earthquake
-Trick Room

I think this would make for an interesting shakeup. It's clear that adding a new type is more likely to buff a pokemon than taking one away in exchange for a retyped move; however the majority of monotype pokemon are in lower tiers, and the majority of OU pokemon have great dual-types, hopefully resulting in a big tier shift and lots of interesting opportunities. Of course, the type removal option will still create some strong sets, but they may be more of a puzzle to find.

Sorry but I think that this meta looks in way too similar to Camomons.

 

[Zarkivez]

Prankmons/Trickmons

Metagame premise: Prankster moves and priority moves used by them bypass Psychic Terrain, Ditto uses its special powders before transforming, and Zoroark copies one move and the ability of pokemon it is disguising as if it has one empty moveslot.
Potential bans and threats: Shedinja, Shadow Tag and Arena Trap as bans, MBanette, Ditto, and Zoroark as threats
Questions for the community:
1: This Metagame is designed to be themed around pranks and tricks. Does it follow/convey that theme while being a playable, fun meta?
2: Zoroark functions in that it can leech one move and ability off of the pokemon it is disguising as, but only as long as the disguise is up. Would this be too overpowered of a buff?
3: Similarly, will Ditto be too overpowered with Quick Powder (Multiplies Ditto’s speed by 2) and Metal Powder ( Multiplies Ditto’s defense by 2) if it gets these boosts while transformed?
4: Does the name of the meta express its premise clearly?

 

[AquaticPanic]

Prankmons/Trickmons

Metagame premise: Prankster moves and priority moves used by them bypass Psychic Terrain, Ditto uses its special powders before transforming, and Zoroark copies one move and the ability of pokemon it is disguising as if it has one empty moveslot.
Potential bans and threats: Shedinja, Shadow Tag and Arena Trap as bans, MBanette, Ditto, and Zoroark as threats
Questions for the community:
1: This Metagame is designed to be themed around pranks and tricks. Does it follow/convey that theme while being a playable, fun meta?
2: Zoroark functions in that it can leech one move and ability off of the pokemon it is disguising as, but only as long as the disguise is up. Would this be too overpowered of a buff?
3: Similarly, will Ditto be too overpowered with Quick Powder (Multiplies Ditto’s speed by 2) and Metal Powder ( Multiplies Ditto’s defense by 2) if it gets these boosts while transformed?
4: Does the name of the meta express its premise clearly?

Pretty sure this would be a Pet Mod, not a meta. They're nice ideas, but only affect Zoroark, Ditto and Prankster mons (With only, like, 3 being relevant), which doesn't make enough changes to create a new meta imo

 

[Zarkivez]

Pretty sure this would be a Pet Mod, not a meta. They're nice ideas, but only affect Zoroark, Ditto and Prankster mons (With only, like, 3 being relevant), which doesn't make enough changes to create a new meta imo

Ok, thanks for the help.

 

[lydian]

Triple Battles

Hey y'all! I've been wanting to post this here for a while to kind of gauge the feedback on this meta. Triples is a very fun metagame in my opinion, and I was pretty sad to see it gone. I feel like it was a pretty cool move on GF's part (unlike rotation battles, eww!) and I feel like it would be nice if it was to become an actual OM once again.
Metagame premise: Gen 5 and 6's Triple Battle Mechanic, but with Gen 7's stuff. As simple as that.
Potential bans and threats: I feel like taking DOU's banlist at first is gonna be a smart idea, the behavior of Pokemon in both metagames is very similar so it would only make sense to take these bans into consideration for this meta as well. Still, Triples is indeed different from DOU, so additional tiering changes would include:

• Ban Perish Song - This move is way too good in Triples, this is true because of how many Pokemon are on field at a time, if your opponent has only 3 Pokemon left it's pretty much an auto-win considering 90% of the Pokemon should run Protect anyways, even if only 2 Pokemon are already defeated, one Pokemon would have to be swapped at a time making the strategy still extremely detrimental and unhealthy.
• Unban Snorlax - Snorlax was banned in DOU mostly because it was too big of a threat when paired with Gothitelle and pivots like Mega Manectric, with only 2 Pokemon for each player, it was rather easy for the GothLax player to trap crippled Pokemon and allow Snorlax to set up with ease. In Triples, however, Snorlax and Gothitelle are much more vulnerable as either will be triple-targetted since they should stay side-by-side for Gothitelle to Heal Pulse Snorlax, this makes it considerably easier for either Snorlax or Gothitelle to be taken down, also crippling two Pokemon with Intimidate or Snarl is considerably easier than doing so with three. The combo might still be an issue, but I think for Triples an unban would only make sense, at least for the initial stages of the metagame.

As for Pokemon that appreciate the triples environment and can be considered bigger threats:

• Spread Move Spammers
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  • We all know how deadly spread moves are in Doubles, but in Triples, they are even worse. A Mega Charizard Y targetting a whopping three Pokemon with a Heat Wave sounds kind of insane, but worry not, it's not broken, just pretty good; you see, for a Pokemon to be able to target all three of its active opponents, it must be in the center, which means it can be triple-targetted.
• Wide Guard users
  
  
  
  
  • With the increase of Spread Move Spam, shall surge an increase of Wide Guard users. Pretty straightforward.
• Trick Room
  
  
  
  
  • With even shorter matches, 5 Trick Room turns now seem like a lot more, the triples layout also allows two exploiters ready to rock after Trick Room has been set up instead of DOU's 1.
• Tailwind
  
  
  
  
  • Just like Trick Room, 4 turns suddenly become a lot more significant. Viable Pokemon such as Mega Charizard-Y, Zapdos, Mew, and Mega Salamence surely appreciate the increase of Tailwind's viability. Tailwind will still be hurt a bit by Trick Room's presence.
• Rain
  
  
  
  
  • In a similar vein to the two conditions above, quicker matches make Rain even more viable. Two great setters in Politoed and Pelipper and two great exploiters in Kingdra and Mega Swampert clearly make the playstyle stand out. Still, Trick Room's influence is not that good of a thing.

Questions for the Community:

• Would you play this metagame?
• Do you think this metagame is too similar to DOU?
• Is there any other tiering change, taking into consideration DOU's banlist, you'd like to suggest?
• Please be honest, do you think the ladder would be too gimmick oriented?

 

[urkerab]

In Triples, however, Snorlax and Gothitelle are much more vulnerable as either will be triple-targetted since they should stay side-by-side for Gothitelle to Heal Pulse Snorlax

Heal Pulse is a Pulse-based move, and can therefore heal across the entire field. On the other hand, should Comfey want to use Floral Healing on Snorlax with +3 priority then it would have to stay side-by-side, but Tapu Bulu would increase its healing to ⅔.

Speaking of moves that can target across the entire field, should Beak Blast and Supersonic Skystrike also be able to target across the entire field? Except for Hidden Power Flying, all single-target Flying-type attacks could do this in Gen 6.

Naturally ROM (now) sports Random Triples Battle, Triples OU, Triples Ubers, Triples UU and of course Triples Hackmons Cup (all with Beak Blast and Supersonic Skystrike able to target across the entire field).

 

[AquaticPanic]

Speaking of moves that can target across the entire field, should Beak Blast and Supersonic Skystrike also be able to target across the entire field? Except for Hidden Power Flying, all single-target Flying-type attacks could do this in Gen 6.

Wouldn't this make it enter the Pet Mod territory tho?

 

[lydian]

Heal Pulse is a Pulse-based move, and can therefore heal across the entire field. On the other hand, should Comfey want to use Floral Healing on Snorlax with +3 priority then it would have to stay side-by-side, but Tapu Bulu would increase its healing to ⅔.

Oh, right, I forgot Pulse moves do that. So maybe GothLax will indeed turn out to be a bigger threat than what I thought at first.

Speaking of moves that can target across the entire field, should Beak Blast and Supersonic Skystrike also be able to target across the entire field? Except for Hidden Power Flying, all single-target Flying-type attacks could do this in Gen 6.

That would only make sense yeah.

Naturally ROM (now) sports Random Triples Battle, Triples OU, Triples Ubers, Triples UU and of course Triples Hackmons Cup (all with Beak Blast and Supersonic Skystrike able to target across the entire field).

Oh, I didn't know ROM had these tiers, would you mind telling me what do you use as a basis for tiering these?

Wouldn't this make it enter the Pet Mod territory tho?

Don't think so, cuz single target flying type moves being able to target non-adjacent foes is a rule, and not an arbitrary decision

 

[urkerab]

Oh, I didn't know ROM had these tiers

That's because it didn't have some of them before!

would you mind telling me what do you use as a basis for tiering these?

Right now they're just Gen 7 Doubles tiers but using the Triples format.

 

[Berlin Arcanine]

Spreadattack/Area of Effect mons
Premise:Ever wanted to hit more than one pokemon with your darmanitan's sheer force boosted flareblitz? Now it's possible. All moves hit all adjacent Pokemon(this includes allies). Spread damage reduction is also in effect(your moves only do 75% damage). This is a doubles based metagame.
Rules and bans:DOU banlist and DOU clauses
Questions: How should z-moves function?
Should there be any exceptions?
Do you think this metagame idea is fun?
What could be improved in this metagame idea?

 

[HeatEdgeSword]

Spreadattack/Area of Effect mons
Premise:Ever wanted to hit more than one pokemon with your darmanitan's sheer force boosted flareblitz? Now it's possible. All moves hit all adjacent Pokemon(this includes allies). Spread damage reduction is also in effect(your moves only do 75% damage). This is a doubles based metagame.
Rules and bans:DOU banlist and DOU clauses
Questions: How should z-moves function?
Should there be any exceptions?
Do you think this metagame idea is fun?
What could be improved in this metagame idea?

Honestly, making all attack act like spread attack sounds like a bad idea. Wide Guard blocks spread move, and it doesn't have the chance to fail for each continuous uses since Generation 6. The battle would devolve into spamming Wide Guard until it runs out of PP.

For a simple improvement, I say make the first moveslot act as a spread attack unless they already are or something similar to that suggestion.

 

[Yoavgreninja]

Honestly, making all attack act like spread attack sounds like a bad idea. Wide Guard blocks spread move, and it doesn't have the chance to fail for each continuous uses since Generation 6. The battle would devolve into spamming Wide Guard until it runs out of PP.

For a simple improvement, I say make the first moveslot should act as a spread attack unless they already are or something similar to that suggestion.

Wide Guard can just be banned

 

[Berlin Arcanine]

Wide Guard can just be banned

Exactly.Thanks for pointing out how broken wide guard would be

 

[AquaticPanic]

Power-Up Punch can become quite a threat imo. May be banworthy, even (Then again, with 3 mons hitting you in one turn, setting up with this can be hard)

 

[Magii]

Power-Up Punch can become quite a threat imo. May be banworthy, even (Then again, with 3 mons hitting you in one turn, setting up with this can be hard)

Power Up Punch would be potent, but I believe that a 40 BP move (albeit boosted with subsequent hits) wouldn’t be a suspect-worthy. Of course, it still would be a threat, but the amount of pokemon that get it is (I think) small, and not all of them are good. A problem, would be Mega Khangaskan’s use of it. After Parental Bond, it is boosted to +6 (assuming there are no ghost types), or the equivalent of a belly drum. While PuP may be somewhat of a threat, the most imposing abuser is MKanga, and that alone (until testing) should have it quickbanned.

 

[hiei-q]

As good pup users i think about mega lop (scrappy guaranties 3 boosts) and bulky priority atackers, like scizor. What i find broken are things like nature madness, or fix damage moves like counter or seismic toss. Weaknesses police combos and serperior are also absurd.

Z moves can be treated by 2 different ways imo: they do 50% damage, or they target. The former option is because 75% would ve too much, and the latter is there to give the user a way to nuke a threat.

I like the idea with spread status only. Being able to will o wisp the entire opponent team and trigger guts on my ally, or use moves that lower defense in order to trigger defiant and make bisharp hit like a truck. I think that a spread status meta is more interesting than spamming attacks.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

Seeing as how Clangerous Soulblaze only boosts once even when it hits two targets, why should PuP be any different?

 

[anaconja]

Seeing as how Clangerous Soulblaze only boosts once even when it hits two targets, why should PuP be any different?

Clangorous Soulblaze does damage, then boosts itself. Power-up-Punch boosts Attack when it hits an opponent. That's why Kangaskhan-Mega boosts twice when it uses it, and why it would boost six times in this meta.

 

[SadisticMystic]

Clangorous Soulblaze gives its boost "when it hits one or more opponents"; if both of the opponents are fairies and/or Soundproof, you do not get a boost, but you still get the same boost level no matter if you hit 1 or hit 2 opponents.

 

[HeatEdgeSword]

@Talks about Power Up Punch: You do realize that Mega Kangaskhan has been banned from Doubles OU, right?

Edit: oh yeah, and the post below

 

[urkerab]

Power Up Punch would be potent, but I believe that a 40 BP move (albeit boosted with subsequent hits) wouldn’t be a suspect-worthy. Of course, it still would be a threat, but the amount of pokemon that get it is (I think) small, and not all of them are good. A problem, would be Mega Khangaskan’s use of it.

Parental Bond doesn't normally apply to spread moves. (But then again, there are no multi-hit spread moves, so what would happen in that case?)

 

[hiei-q]

S.T.A.M (Sleep Talk, Assist, Metronome)

Metagame premise: Moves with random selection can filter the list of available moves they can select depending on the plate/Z cristal the pokemon is holding and the place the move is located in the moveslot. Plates are impossible to be removed/lost.

Rules:
-Moves that depend on random selection like sleep talk, metronome and assist will select a move that has the same typing than the plate or z cristal the pokemon is holding.
-Plates are impossible to be removed or lost, this has been done in order to protect the pokemon from being knock-offed and, specially, tricked into another plate.
-The type of move chosen depend on the place on the moveslot. A random selection move in the first slot will always be a physical attack, a random selection move in the second slot will be a special attack, and a random selection move in the third slot will be status. A move in the fourth slot will not filter the type of the move.
-If no move can be used due to the filter, then the pokemon should miss. If that is not possible, then the pokemon should use struggle or any random move (like if there is no filter).
-Hidden power type depend on iv's (usually dark).

Banlist: Ou banlist and Ou clauses. Sleep clause might be removed to promote sleep talk usage even more. Normalium Z + assist might get complex banned (due to shell smash).

Threats: I think about grass types if sleep talk is removed, might become centralizing due to their acces to spore and ability to absorb it. Here are some funny sets.

Standard Mega Talker

Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sleep Talk
- Dragon Claw
- Fire Punch
- Rest

Megas dont get acces to items so they cant filter types, however, most of them posees a decent bulk that allow them to absorb spore and counterattack. In the case of Mega Zard X, first placement on sleep talk allow Zard to always use dragon claw or fire punch. DD instead of one of them allow him to use always the same attack.

Draco plate Electivire

Electivire @ Draco Plate
Ability: Vital Spirit
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Wild Charge
- Earthquake
- Metronome
- Ice Punch

Electivire may be decent in this meta, metronome in third slot + draco plate = dragon type status move = dragon dance. He is also inmune to sleep with vital spirit, so he can be used as an alternative to tapu koko. Motor drive can be used instead if you have koko support and if you want something to check other kokos.

V spam liepard

Liepard @ Flame Plate
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Assist
- Taunt
- Foul Play
- Fake Out

By having victini on your team you can access to priority v create. Taunt also keep sleep pokemon inactive. If you have no other physical attacks on your other 5 mons, you can run choice band, but that might be quite restricting to teambuilding. Weavile and infernape are also v create abusers.

Trolloom

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spore
- Rock Slide
- Bullet Seed
- Wake-Up Slap

Send your opponent to sleep, and when he clicks sleep talk, wake him up.

Buggium Z Hymno

Hypno @ Buginium Z
Ability: Insomnia
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dream Eater
- Hypnosis
- Assist
- Signal Beam

Assist is to get quiver dance from volcarona, and dream eater is way more effective in a no sleep clause meta. Dark types can get nuked with bugium Z Signal Beam.

Questions for the comunity :
-Do you like the idea?
-Is there a random selection move that i am forgetting about?
-What do you think about a potential sleep clause removal?

 

[AquaticPanic]

I like the concept, tho I really don't think Hidden Power should be changed.

 

[hiei-q]

I was meaning iv's not ev's. If a pokemon alredy have hidden power it should be the type you select for him in teambuilder, but otherwise it should depend on iv's. I bring this up because you might get an undesirable hidden power as random special attack. How should hidden power type works?