Hard-Boiled Detectives Only! [Post-game Spoilers]

[Scepticallistic]

I understand there is already a postgame content discussion thread, but I felt like this part of it deserved its own discussion. I'd be sad if it didn't, but if mods are going to remove it, maybe save me a copy of my OP for me (that's probably too much).


If you haven't already gotten to the point of the game where this thread title makes sense, then you should probably avoid this place. It contains major spoilers for post-game content.





Anyway, as many of you who have gotten this far know, we meet Looker of the International Police once again! I don't know why, but this sub-plot is probably the greatest thing they've ever written in Pokemon. It just really clicked for me, and I had a blast doing it.

Besides really fleshing out the Looker character further, we meet a great new character in Emma and Mimi (an adorable and touching duo) as well as get confirmation that Malva of the Elite Four was part of Team Flare! I'd recognize those pants anywhere. We also see Dr. Xerosic again as a main antagonist, which was great, considering we only saw him for like 3 minutes during the main plot. I loved these nods, and having an E4 member being part of the villainous team really hearkened me back to the Pokemon Adventures manga.

Looker is a great actor, as I'd expect an undercover cop to be. I was really concerned about his feigned financial concerns, especially when he took in Emma. That touched me more than any other plot in Pokemon (except maybe N [and still loses to Pokemon Mystery Dungeon plots]) because it felt so real. It wasn't some grandiose, saving-the-world trope. This hit home even more with how real the "economy" felt in this game. It still could not exist in the real world, but having you part liberally with money with tipping minstrels, shopping, food consumption, rides...it was a really great experience. Building up celebrity clout in Lumiose is the best thing ever, and having people recognize you as Champion is finally a good change. The details and behavior of Pokemon X and Y make them the best games ever for me.

• I enjoyed how they always experiment with morally ambiguous antagonists. Dr. Xerosic was redeeming in that he loved his research, and he was willing to turn himself in. Emma was a great plot point for everyone.

• The punks were successfully difficult to understand but endearing. The museum curator was surprisingly forward thinking. Essentia was badass. The Looker themes and classic noir-style detective music and musings were incredible. Everything was great.

• I was also convinced that Emma was telling the truth about Looker's Pokemon! In the beginning chapters, I thought Looker had a failed mission where he lost his Croagunk tragically and was kicked off the Police force, and now he's trying for a new start in Kalos with a suffering business. That was really sad to me.

What are your thoughts? What do you think happened to Looker's Croagunk? Where are Looker and Xerosic headed? What are your thoughts on the market in this game?

I was convinced after seeing Malva again that this would trigger the powered up Elite Four rematches, but no dice...that was one disappointing aspect.

Sorry for the slightly rambly thread, but I'd like to get a good discussion going on this great addition to the game!

 

[Master WGS]

I loved the missions/storyline itself, but was bummed it didn't really unlock anything. An Elite Four power-up would've been great, but I would've also loved a special outfit item (detective jacket/slacks?), or maybe have Mimi join you on your quest and have a special ability/move.

That disappointment aside, I think this is the best subplot in a mainline Pokemon game by far. Genuinely funny and sad, which is rare considering the sugar-coated stories Game Freak likes to tell.

 

[Lord Jesseus]

But... but Croagunk. :(
I kind of feel like we'll be seeing Emma again in the next games. Ending the story with that suit seems like it has potential in a more critical plot line.

 

[Quanyails]

I liked this post-game sub-plot better than the other main Pokemon storylines that've been given in the games, mostly because it's less predictable and different than the main storyline. I found Chapter 1 a bit silly with its fetch quest and But Thou Must promotion, but after that, I didn't mind it if it was to let the story come first. Granted, Looker's sub-plot essentially also is a twice-told tale, but I am still impressed, again, by the audacity of a more serious story in a setting where I have come to expect the same nebulous and tenuous motions. I was wondering what the empty tenant space and separate-map alleys in Lumiose were meant for, and I was pleasantly surprised at their revelation and integration into Lumiose's atmosphere, so to speak.

Each of the main characters was distinguishable and fleshed out--archetypical, as it were, but not flat. Even if Emma is the naive child with a heart of gold and Looker acts the straight-edge, comically serious character, both of them have strengths and flaws that do not lie along that one direction. I was pleasantly surprised that Emma knew Japanese (is there a translation of that dialogue anywhere?) and that Looker harbored a genuine, patriarchal care for her even after revealing his true purpose in Lumiose. There is more ambiguity to Xerosic's actions than Lysandre's, and he is treated as a more sympathetic character compared to him. It's a relief to me, since I personally like morally ambiguous antagonists, and many Pokemon characters are absolute in morality. Then there's the Lumiose Gang, which aren't just punch-clock villains as many NPCs are, but they scrap to get by and show that they're decent people outside of Pokemon battles. The characters also have lines with variety in them that doesn't steep into cheese; that's a sprinkle of sugar on the cherry on the frosted cupcake of Pokemon X/Y.

I believe that this sub-plot is intended to appeal to the older audience so that it can enjoy the plot while still being tucked away so that the younger audience won't mind. It's not revolutionary by any means, but I'd certainly like to see more stories with this tone in these games. Ah, I'm playing the wrong game if that's what I expect, but it'd be a wonderful bonus if Game Freak kept these for the next games.

 

[TM13IceBeam]

*hard-broiled

we ain't eggs yo

 

[thelaytonmobile]

Yes, this subplot was great! Really liked the dynamic between Xerosic and Emma, and the way he became a more sympathetic character whilst still retaining his science-obsessed personality.
Now I'm just waiting for a future game, where the protagonist and friends are trapped by the bad guys...
"We can't surmount this obstacle with our Pokemon gone! If only we had the strength and speed of a Pokemon... and perhaps some kind of transforming ability!"

Also, Looker really is a genius. He figured out by BW that you need the main character to get anything done in Pokemon, so in this game he just figures out who the player character is, and straight-up makes you his partner. Cleverer than every other character in Pokemon.

 

[Lord Jesseus]

^haha, the idea of Looker as being not only clever but also savvy on a meta level is quite amusing.

*hard-broiled

we ain't eggs yo

There is no such thing as hard-broiled...

Hard-boiled is the correct term. We aren't eggs. It's a metaphor.

 

[DHR-107]

Also, Looker really is a genius. He figured out by BW that you need the main character to get anything done in Pokemon, so in this game he just figures out who the player character is, and straight-up makes you his partner. Cleverer than every other character in Pokemon.

Previous champion isnt good enough eh? haha...

I've started this set of quests on my X game, but I havent delved any deeper yet. I hope it is as good as you guys say! :o

 

[farranpoison]

In terms of the Japanese dialogue in that one scene, I was pleasantly surprised, even more so since I can read Japanese. I was laughing a bit though at how the Mimi translation basically just gave about 25% (the main points) of the contents of the conversations. Emma was pretty pissed at the lady for talking shit about Looker.

As for the sidequest itself, it was amazing. I wish the main plot was like that. Heck, I'd have preferred if Emma was your friend/rival/main plot important npc rather than those terrible friends (besides the rival). And that smile at the end...

I really am hoping Emma becomes important in the next game or that she gets her own spinoff or something. She's got personality, and got that awesome suit, and succeeding Looker? Where's that detective Pokemon spinoff game, GF?

 

[Impy]

I felt so sorry for the guy. Looker was such a vibrant, weird person in the previous games, but in this one he's grizzled, subdued and tired. When I found out his Croagunk got killed, it clicked: He's fizzled out. Something tells me he's not even really with the International Police anymore, and has taken up a job as a sort of bounty hunter, or private investigator, out on his own. It's kind of sad, but, knowing Looker he'll be fine. He can bust criminals in a world where firearms are replaced by vicious elemental monsters, and he's effectively unarmed. The guy's a badass.

On another note, Emma's one of the most fleshed-out characters in any of the main games, and I was surprised to find that Xerosic wasn't quite as utterly batshit as I thought. At least he's a good employer, even if he keeps his people in the dark.

I really am hoping Emma becomes important in the next game or that she gets her own spinoff or something. She's got personality, and got that awesome suit, and succeeding Looker? Where's that detective Pokemon spinoff game, GF?

Oh, there is one!

It revolves around a talking Marill blue Pikachu. Yes, it's probably as awful as it sounds.

 

[Codraroll]

I also truly enjoyed the Looker chapters. Heck, I'd love it if they had simply went for "you being Looker's assistant" as the main plot of the game. He'd send you to prof. Sycamore to get some Pokémon, and you'd fight the gyms more as a hobby (or out of necessity, because badges are required for field moves). When the story is over and the baddies are defeated, you'd figure out that hey, you're actually qualified to take on the Elite Four now, so you might as well aim for the very top in Pokémon battling now that Looker doesn't need you any more.

Anyway, even as a post-game story, it was sweet. Easily the best plotline of a main series Pokémon game to date. It also showcased the size of Lumiose City: You visited a bunch of places around town during the chapters, yet if you've done some previous exploring, you know that the quests didn't take you to half the places the city has to offer. The story utilized the city brilliantly, using a pre-existing location and shaping the plot around it, rather than vice versa. Most other Pokémon locations appear to be designed with the story in mind first, then the locations are made to fit the narrative.

Oh, and the characters. Emma and Looker were both well written, and much has been said about them and Mimi already, so I'll talk a little about the remaining two (four?) characters.

First, Xerosic. This was a villain I could sort of understand. He's Team Flare's head engineer (or at least second behind Lysandre), working on this super-awesome power suit concept. He has probably spent thousands of hours in predesign, had long arguments with Lysandre about funding, conducted component tests, programmed the parts to work together and almost got a prototype ready. Years of work is this close to bear fruits when Lysandre goes bananas and destroys Team Flare's headquarters, kills himself(?) and effectively disbands the organization. All that work is suddenly for nought. Team Flare is gone, and his power suit will never be finished (illegal as it is, he wouldn't get funding to finish it).
However, the prototype remains intact, as work on it was conducted at Team Flare's Lumiose City base. Xerosic decides to finish the work he has spent so long on, and spends the last of his savings on finishing the design. Team Flare's ideology is gone now, Xerosic and the other admins probably had a meeting and decided to disband the team, but that ideology shaped the suit's design requirements. For the past few years, Xerosic has been wondering if his design would meet those requirements. Prototype testing couldn't have been more than weeks away when Team Flare went down the drain. The suit was built for crime and stealing Pokémon, so committing crime and stealing Pokémon with it was the only way to test it against the criteria.
Harming or abusing Emma was never Xerosic's intentions, but she had to be controlled for testing to be done properly. The suit required somebody to wear it to work. Note the use of the code name "Essentia", which probably was the project name for the suit. Xerosic doesn't refer to his "servant" as Emma, it's the suit he is talking about when addressing her. Emma was just the component required to get it to work, the faceless user of the product.
However, Xerosic got a little carried overboard at the end, which he realized upon hearing Emma's screams as she struggled against the control mechanisms. A sort of "My god what have I done" moment. He got enough, he realized that the suit had proven its worth, the project was a success. Now, there was no need to keep pressing Emma. The job was over, and his eagerness on continuing couldn't even be justified for the sake of science. He was turning evil, and probably dumbstruck by the realization. Now, having proved that the project went well, Xerosic turned himself in.
In short, Xerosic was just an enthusiastic inventor who had his grandest project cancelled at the very final phase. He had no criminal intentions, he just did what he had to so he could finish his work. All the while, he treated Emma well (when separated from the suit, that is), and even included her in the work. Even though she was clueless about what she was doing while "napping", she was asked to find somebody to help with security. Which brings us to...

The Lumiose Gang. Probably a gang of scumbag criminals, but you have to admire their respect towards Emma, and eventually the player. They are nice and polite when you find them in Lysandre Labs. After Emma manages to convince them to stay on the narrow path, they do so, and do their work with honest enthusiasm. Emma gave them their first proper job, that is keeping security in Lysandre Labs, and although they respect the player when (s)he enters the lab, it is trespassing per definition, so they have to fight you. But even when defeated, they seem cool about it, and even chat friendly with you before and after the battles. They even express some individuality, although the girls are hard to tell apart. One claims to be the one bringing colour to the group, so that's something, at least.


I was also a little puzzled that the Looker chapters never touched upon the ghost in that building. I had thought that a fitting mystery for Looker to solve, yet it is never addressed. Either, it will be an event somehow, or GameFreak are trying to reinvent the SS Anne Truck. It has worked so far, at least.

 

[Stone RG]

Awesome sub plot in all of its glory, like you said yourself, its not about some saving the world mission we must do because we are the choen ones or some crap like that, it was a different plot that went through more development on all of its characters than almost any other in any mains series pokemon game.

I was really dissapointed by the story, expecting for something like what we got in BW or some epic portrait of a character and villains like in BW2 and Platinum, but instead we got really unrememberable grunts AND admins, considering they had an extremely well portraited leader in Lysandre. When i went to Lumiose thinking id receive the Pokeradar there and got a call from Looker i felt hooked, i knew he was coming back. Chapter 1 was eh, ill agree with most on that, but the next 4 really got us to know Emma and her problems on having nothing to thank Looker with, who saved her from the alleys.

I found Xerosic to be a Ghetsis-like anatagonist at first, around chapter 4, using Emma, who was at an emotional disadvantage, as a test subject to a potentially deadly suit, as well as making her go against all Looker had tried to help her with, and yeah, on that note, i found Essentia, both her name and attitude, pretty badass. Then in Chapter 5 we find out he only had a love for science, which i found a prety bad excuse considering he was a big part of a plan to kill all humanity, unless he is THAT crazy.

All around great plot, the soundtrack really made me feel like this was a ''hard boiled detective'' mission, and of course, Looker going away made me sad, i always loved his character, he wouldve been a better Champion than Diantha, i am sure of that.

 

[Skyblade12]

I really liked the plot as well.

That said, I think that it's a crying shame that this sort of quality writing wasn't in the main plot.

Malva was a big disappointment, to be honest. Not her reveal to be a part of Team Flare. I thought that was great, and the game did an excellent job of hinting at it enough to let you guess it. And having an Elite Four bad guy is great, and, as some have said, brings to mind Pokémon Adventures. That said, what is her purpose on the Team? GameFreak's desire to have Diantha be a completely bland, uninvolved character, just to spring the Champion reveal on you, means that Malva has no importance to the story or even her team's plan.
Think of how much better it would have been to have met the Elite Four members and Champion earlier, and have the Malva reveal come near Lysandre's transmission. Suddenly you have a very powerful Trainer able to set up an excellent ambush and give a good reason why the Champion and Elite Four members might be unable to help stop Team Flare. Instead... Malva just sits and does nothing while Team Flare's defining moment of existence is carried out. The entire purpose of the Team, it's only goal... And she does nothing. Just like the Champion. Disappointing.

I suppose that's really a criticism of the main plot, though. But I do think the Malva reveal only further brought down the quality of the main game's story, as much as it helped the story of the Looker missions themselves.

Also, like several others, I was disappointed that there was nothing else unlocked by it. Essentia battles are ok, but she only has two Pokémon. Where are the buffed Elite Four? New outfit? New utility item? New feature/mechanic? Something to help lengthen and boost the post-endgame content.

 

[StallMandibuzz]

I really liked the plot as well.

That said, I think that it's a crying shame that this sort of quality writing wasn't in the main plot.

Malva was a big disappointment, to be honest. Not her reveal to be a part of Team Flare. I thought that was great, and the game did an excellent job of hinting at it enough to let you guess it. And having an Elite Four bad guy is great, and, as some have said, brings to mind Pokémon Adventures. That said, what is her purpose on the Team? GameFreak's desire to have Diantha be a completely bland, uninvolved character, just to spring the Champion reveal on you, means that Malva has no importance to the story or even her team's plan.
Think of how much better it would have been to have met the Elite Four members and Champion earlier, and have the Malva reveal come near Lysandre's transmission. Suddenly you have a very powerful Trainer able to set up an excellent ambush and give a good reason why the Champion and Elite Four members might be unable to help stop Team Flare. Instead... Malva just sits and does nothing while Team Flare's defining moment of existence is carried out. The entire purpose of the Team, it's only goal... And she does nothing. Just like the Champion. Disappointing.

I suppose that's really a criticism of the main plot, though. But I do think the Malva reveal only further brought down the quality of the main game's story, as much as it helped the story of the Looker missions themselves.

Also, like several others, I was disappointed that there was nothing else unlocked by it. Essentia battles are ok, but she only has two Pokémon. Where are the buffed Elite Four? New outfit? New utility item? New feature/mechanic? Something to help lengthen and boost the post-endgame content.

I'm with you, Sky, I was quite disappointed with the storyline in general. They had something good going on there with the 'Malva being a psychotic member of Team Flare' path, but for some reason, they didn't do ANYTHING AT ALL with it, which pisses me off. Diantha was a pretty boring Champion too, honestly. They could have had something going if Malva reveals herself to be a Flare member when Lysandre makes his not-so-hidden 'IMMA FIRING MAH LAZER!' reveal, and she keeps Diantha and the other 3 E4 away while Lysandre does his plan. Hopefully if they make a sequel, they really rehash Team Flare and make them better. :I *rant on sucky storyline over for now*

On the topic of Looker's stories, I always thought Looker was irritating, but surprisingly, he was actually not as irritating as he was in games past. The Looker stories weren't too bad; they were practically the only post-game thing that was even worth doing, or that you could do. Pity. :I If this was the type of quality that Team Flare's main story implemented, I'd be very happy. *hopes for a not-sucky Neo Flare team, with an amazing plot like the Looker stories*