Great Sage
Banned deucer.
http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/snorlax
The analysis looks a bit lacking in content, so I wrote this. The sets haven't been changed much, except I've taken out the offensive EVs on the Curse set, because seriously, Snorlax just can't afford it and it doesn't make much of a difference, since Curse ups its offensive capabilities anyways. If anyone can find a somewhat common instance where the 44 Attack EVs make a real difference (as in turning a 3HKO into a 2HKO or whatever), I'll put them back in. Also, I have a weird feeling there's a horribly obvious counter I missed, so if anyone notices something, tell me.
[SET]
name: Curselax
move 1: Curse
move 2: Body Slam / Return
move 3: Rest / Selfdestruct
move 4: Earthquake / Crunch / Fire Punch
item: Leftovers
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Careful
evs: 168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>While Curselax has historically been the epitome of power and durability, it has become far less stable in the highly offensive D/P metagame; however, it still poses a significant threat to unprepared individuals. As expected, Curse is the crux of this set; it boosts Snorlax's mediocre Defense and good Attack while dropping its useless Speed, so that Snorlax is reasonably good at taking attacks from both ends of the offensive spectrum, and deal decent damage itself. Whether to use Body Slam or Return for its Normal STAB is sheerly a matter of power or paralysis. Generally, the paralysis is more useful for Snorlax, but if one feels that a bit more power is favorable, Return is available for 20% greater force. One may note that Double-edge is sadly absent from this set; unlike previous generations, Snorlax can't afford to squander as much of its HP on recoil damage.</p>
<p>The next choice is whether to attempt to remain alive longer with Rest and risk the opponent setting up while Snorlax is asleep, or to shirk longevity and destroy something on the way out with a STAB Selfdestruct. Prior to D/P, Rest was overwhelmingly more useful, but in D/P, Selfdestruct has risen to a level plane with it, as sleeping for two turns is a significantly greater liability, whereas Selfdestruct is the emergency resource so many teams need in order to combat an unexpected reversal. The last move is also quite variable. Earthquake is often the preferred option to hit Tyranitar, Metagross, and others, but leaves Snorlax completely vulnerable to Mismagius, and to some extent, Gengar (note that without Focus Blast or Perish Song, Gengar will be stalled out of PP by Snorlax if the latter has Rest). Crunch hurts the Ghosts at the expense of being futile against the first group. Fire Punch is the compromise option, which deals well with both the Ghosts and Metagross; Tyranitar still switches in with impunity, however.</p>
<p>The EVs on this Snorlax are configured for optimal defensive efficiency; while displacing 4 EVs from Special Defense to HP would provide a slight amount more of overall defenses, that course has not been taken because if it were, Snorlax would have 504 HP, which is divisible by 8 and therefore would make it more susceptible to residual damage than if the current 503 HP spread was utilized. This spread focuses primarily on improving its special defensive capabilities, but also maintains a solidity in its physically defensive sector to make switching in and taking attacks after few Curses easier. While investing some EVs into Attack may seem tempting, the fact is that Snorlax simply can't afford to do so in D/P; even with this spread, Snorlax can take up to 54% from a Choice Specs Modest Salamence's Draco Meteor, 60% from a Life Orb Timid Azelf's Nasty Plotted Psychic, and 83% from a Life Orb Modest Porygon-Z's Nasty Plotted Adaptability Tri Attack.</p>
<p>Thick Fat is the more useful trait, as Rest will rid Snorlax of any poisoning it suffers, and Thick Fat grants an effective resistance to Ice and Fire, two of the most common special attacks. Additionally, it is pivotal to countering Heatran, especially when Snorlax doesn't have Earthquake to OHKO it, and is an excellent buffer for a predicted switch-in on Weavile's Ice Punch and such. However, if one selects Selfdestruct over Rest, Immunity still has some utility, especially against Toxic Spikes.</p>
[SET]
name: Sleep Talk
move 1: Rest
move 2: Sleep Talk
move 3: Body Slam
move 4: Earthquake / Crunch / Fire Blast
item: Leftovers
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Careful / Sassy
evs: 244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Sleep Talk Snorlax sacrifices the sweeping potential of Curselax in exchange for improved durability, as it is no longer switch-in bait while it is Resting. Indeed, Snorlax is excellent for absorbing sleep for the rest of its team, as it trumps many sleepers, such as Gengar and Milotic. As this set will likely remain at the 256 Attack it starts out with unless one intends to Baton Pass Attack boosts to it, Body Slam's paralysis chance becomes a greater deterrent to set-up Pokémon than Return's straightforward damage, and consequently it becomes significantly more favored. Earthquake and Crunch still work the same way as on Curselax, but Fire Blast has replaced Fire Punch for hitting Steel-types. As most Steel-types have higher Defense than Special Defense, Fire Punch's lower base power will ultimately do less damage than Fire Blast, despite Snorlax's higher Attack. For example, assuming a Sassy nature in the case of Fire Blast, Fire Punch does a measly 26% at maximum to Skarmory, whereas Fire Blast can do up to 58%.</p>
<p>As this Snorlax is used exclusively for walling special attacks and shouldn't be taking any strong physical attacks, it is even more special defensively oriented than Curselax. However, a small dash of Defense is available, feeding off the "just because" philosophy, for taking the occasional weaker physical attack. Sassy nature is required on sets with Fire Blast for the guaranteed OHKO on the standard Forretress; Snorlax isn't going to use its Speed for much anyways.</p>
[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Body Slam / Return
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Crunch / Selfdestruct
move 4: Fire Punch / Selfdestruct
item: Choice Band
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>As a wall, Snorlax is a bit lackluster in D/P, but as a Choice Bander, it is as stable as Choice Banders come. Instead of fretting over which Pokémon will stop it, Choice Band Snorlax is equipped to handle anything Curselax might not. Body Slam still supersedes Return on this set, as Choice Band Snorlax, being one of the slowest Pokémon available, prefers 30% paralysis over immediate power, unlike many of its Choice brethren. Earthquake is standard fare and doesn't have to vie for a slot anymore; however, the third and fourth slots are contested by other moves. Crunch is for Ghost-types and Fire Punch is the compromise move that hits both Levitating Ghosts like Gengar and Steels. Either may be replaced by Selfdestruct, which, due to STAB, is one of the most powerful attacks in thePokémon franchise; Selfdestruct even has a small chance of OHKOing the standard Skarmory.</p>
<p>Snorlax is outrunning little if anything, so instead of Speed, EVs have been invested in its Special Defense. This way, Snorlax maintains a reasonable degree of special survivability with which to switch in against special attackers; Thick Fat furthers that goal.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>Pursuit is a very good move to essentially trap Gengar, Mismagius, and many Psychics, who have good reason to fear Snorlax, but is unfortunately illegal with both Selfdestruct and Fire Punch. Ice Punch significantly hurts Garchomp and Salamence, and ThunderPunch annihilates Gyarados, but neither is extremely useful on Snorlax. Zen Headbutt is super effective on Gengar and Weezing, but will not OHKO the latter before it uses Haze and is merely a less accurate Crunch replacement for the former. Focus Punch delivers a very powerful hit on Rhyperior and Bronzong, and OHKOes Tyranitar, but generally is outclassed by Earthquake or Fire Punch. Instead of attacking Metagross and Tyranitar directly, Snorlax can also make them faint through its massive HP and Counter; Snorlax will usually survive any physical hit that isn't Fighting type or boosted more than once.</p>
<p>Snorlax gets Whirlwind in D/P, but as an offensive wall, it is usually much better suited to killing its opposition than blowing their boosts away. Amnesia and Charm can lighten the hits Snorlax receives, but Snorlax would much rather Curse against physical hits and just attack special attackers; Charm can force a few switches to gain Stealth Rock and Spikes damage, though. Belly Drum is an explosive alternative to Curse, but unfortunately Snorlax is, as already noted several times, extremely slow, and its Defense is just passable. However, along with Block, a timely Belly Drum can be deadly for the opposition once all Ghosts have been murdered by Pursuit. Yawn is another move that can force switches and works well with Belly Drum.</p>
<p>As expected for a Normal-type, Snorlax receives a host of special attacks to use off its pitiful base 65 Special Attack. Other than Fire Blast, Ice Beam and Surf are the only ones that would possibly have any practical application. Ice Beam can score an unexpected KO on Gliscor and Garchomp, but Surf hits Rhyperior decently even in Sandstorm conditions and thoroughly guts it if such conditions are nonexistent. However, it does at maximum, assuming Snorlax has no Special Attack EVs, a pathetic 23% on Tyranitar.</p>
[EVs]
<p>Snorlax should generally focus on buffering its HP and Special Defense, and sprinkle a little bit in Defense on the Curse and Sleep Talk sets. Note that unlike most others, Snorlax doesn't derive its best defensive combination by maximizing HP, as its HP is titanic compared to its Defense and Special Defense. However, the Choice Band version should also maximize its Attack, whereas offensive EVs are unnecessary on other sets.</p>
[Opinion]
<p>Snorlax, once among the most dominant Pokémon in the entire game, has taken a dramatic fall from grace in D/P, with the advent of extremely powerful special attackers like Azelf and Porygon-Z that essentially necessitate the use of sturdier special walls like Blissey. Focus Blast or Aura Sphere from competent special attackers Snorlax could previously wall, such as Gengar and Alakazam, has taken it down another notch. Strong physical attacks responsible for the renewed popularity of Machamp, Heracross, and others have limited the pool of Pokémon Snorlax can switch in on safely.</p>
<p>However, Snorlax still has a place in many teams, as when it is the last Pokémon, it becomes incredibly difficult for stall teams to take down. Paralysis from Body Slam incapacitates many opponents as always, and Thick Fat allows Snorlax to become among the most reliable counters to Fire and Ice-types.</p>
[Counters]
<p>Snorlax is nowhere as impregnable as it was during previous generations, and therefore has many potential counters; note that whatever counters Curselax tends to counter the Sleep Talk set as well. Strong Fighting-types that can survive a Body Slam tend to work excellently. Choice Band Heracross, Machamp, and Gallade's Close Combats will always OHKO the standard Curselax even after one Curse. If Curselax doesn't have Crunch or Fire Punch, Gengar and Mismagius are totally impervious to its assaults and Focus Blast or Calm Mind up, respectively. If it doesn't have Earthquake or Fire Punch, Metagross can switch in on a Body Slam (beware of paralysis) or Crunch and 2HKO with Choice Banded Meteor Mash, assuming Snorlax uses Curse immediately after the first Meteor Mash. The same follows for Choice Band Tyranitar regarding sets without Earthquake.</p>
<p>Snorlax can also be beaten by special attackers other than Ghosts. If it doesn't have Earthquake or Fire Punch, even Curselax falls to Calm Mind Jirachi, whose high Defense and Steel typing shield it from Crunch. Suicune with Roar can stat up alongside Snorlax and Roar it out whenever it gets too many boosts. Both physical and special Lucario will triumph against Snorlax that elect to have Crunch as the auxiliary move; the physical versions will often OHKO with Close Combat assuming Snorlax doesn't have any Curses, and the special versions with Choice Specs easily 2HKO with Aura Sphere regardless.</p>
<p>Skarmory's high Defense lets it take on any Snorlax with ease except those carrying Fire Blast while it lays down Spikes or Stealth Rock and Whirlwinds Snorlax out when it becomes uncomfortably laden with Curses, but can't do any real damage against it and therefore loses if Snorlax is the last Pokémon. Weezing, on the other hand, trades reliable healing and field-affecting moves for Haze, which wipes out Snorlax's Curses at any time, and disregard for Fire Blast. Gliscor can Taunt to stop Snorlax from Cursing in the short term; if it has Swords Dance, it can set up and Baton Pass to a more powerful attacker.</p>
The analysis looks a bit lacking in content, so I wrote this. The sets haven't been changed much, except I've taken out the offensive EVs on the Curse set, because seriously, Snorlax just can't afford it and it doesn't make much of a difference, since Curse ups its offensive capabilities anyways. If anyone can find a somewhat common instance where the 44 Attack EVs make a real difference (as in turning a 3HKO into a 2HKO or whatever), I'll put them back in. Also, I have a weird feeling there's a horribly obvious counter I missed, so if anyone notices something, tell me.
[SET]
name: Curselax
move 1: Curse
move 2: Body Slam / Return
move 3: Rest / Selfdestruct
move 4: Earthquake / Crunch / Fire Punch
item: Leftovers
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Careful
evs: 168 HP / 120 Def / 220 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>While Curselax has historically been the epitome of power and durability, it has become far less stable in the highly offensive D/P metagame; however, it still poses a significant threat to unprepared individuals. As expected, Curse is the crux of this set; it boosts Snorlax's mediocre Defense and good Attack while dropping its useless Speed, so that Snorlax is reasonably good at taking attacks from both ends of the offensive spectrum, and deal decent damage itself. Whether to use Body Slam or Return for its Normal STAB is sheerly a matter of power or paralysis. Generally, the paralysis is more useful for Snorlax, but if one feels that a bit more power is favorable, Return is available for 20% greater force. One may note that Double-edge is sadly absent from this set; unlike previous generations, Snorlax can't afford to squander as much of its HP on recoil damage.</p>
<p>The next choice is whether to attempt to remain alive longer with Rest and risk the opponent setting up while Snorlax is asleep, or to shirk longevity and destroy something on the way out with a STAB Selfdestruct. Prior to D/P, Rest was overwhelmingly more useful, but in D/P, Selfdestruct has risen to a level plane with it, as sleeping for two turns is a significantly greater liability, whereas Selfdestruct is the emergency resource so many teams need in order to combat an unexpected reversal. The last move is also quite variable. Earthquake is often the preferred option to hit Tyranitar, Metagross, and others, but leaves Snorlax completely vulnerable to Mismagius, and to some extent, Gengar (note that without Focus Blast or Perish Song, Gengar will be stalled out of PP by Snorlax if the latter has Rest). Crunch hurts the Ghosts at the expense of being futile against the first group. Fire Punch is the compromise option, which deals well with both the Ghosts and Metagross; Tyranitar still switches in with impunity, however.</p>
<p>The EVs on this Snorlax are configured for optimal defensive efficiency; while displacing 4 EVs from Special Defense to HP would provide a slight amount more of overall defenses, that course has not been taken because if it were, Snorlax would have 504 HP, which is divisible by 8 and therefore would make it more susceptible to residual damage than if the current 503 HP spread was utilized. This spread focuses primarily on improving its special defensive capabilities, but also maintains a solidity in its physically defensive sector to make switching in and taking attacks after few Curses easier. While investing some EVs into Attack may seem tempting, the fact is that Snorlax simply can't afford to do so in D/P; even with this spread, Snorlax can take up to 54% from a Choice Specs Modest Salamence's Draco Meteor, 60% from a Life Orb Timid Azelf's Nasty Plotted Psychic, and 83% from a Life Orb Modest Porygon-Z's Nasty Plotted Adaptability Tri Attack.</p>
<p>Thick Fat is the more useful trait, as Rest will rid Snorlax of any poisoning it suffers, and Thick Fat grants an effective resistance to Ice and Fire, two of the most common special attacks. Additionally, it is pivotal to countering Heatran, especially when Snorlax doesn't have Earthquake to OHKO it, and is an excellent buffer for a predicted switch-in on Weavile's Ice Punch and such. However, if one selects Selfdestruct over Rest, Immunity still has some utility, especially against Toxic Spikes.</p>
[SET]
name: Sleep Talk
move 1: Rest
move 2: Sleep Talk
move 3: Body Slam
move 4: Earthquake / Crunch / Fire Blast
item: Leftovers
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Careful / Sassy
evs: 244 HP / 28 Def / 236 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Sleep Talk Snorlax sacrifices the sweeping potential of Curselax in exchange for improved durability, as it is no longer switch-in bait while it is Resting. Indeed, Snorlax is excellent for absorbing sleep for the rest of its team, as it trumps many sleepers, such as Gengar and Milotic. As this set will likely remain at the 256 Attack it starts out with unless one intends to Baton Pass Attack boosts to it, Body Slam's paralysis chance becomes a greater deterrent to set-up Pokémon than Return's straightforward damage, and consequently it becomes significantly more favored. Earthquake and Crunch still work the same way as on Curselax, but Fire Blast has replaced Fire Punch for hitting Steel-types. As most Steel-types have higher Defense than Special Defense, Fire Punch's lower base power will ultimately do less damage than Fire Blast, despite Snorlax's higher Attack. For example, assuming a Sassy nature in the case of Fire Blast, Fire Punch does a measly 26% at maximum to Skarmory, whereas Fire Blast can do up to 58%.</p>
<p>As this Snorlax is used exclusively for walling special attacks and shouldn't be taking any strong physical attacks, it is even more special defensively oriented than Curselax. However, a small dash of Defense is available, feeding off the "just because" philosophy, for taking the occasional weaker physical attack. Sassy nature is required on sets with Fire Blast for the guaranteed OHKO on the standard Forretress; Snorlax isn't going to use its Speed for much anyways.</p>
[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Body Slam / Return
move 2: Earthquake
move 3: Crunch / Selfdestruct
move 4: Fire Punch / Selfdestruct
item: Choice Band
ability: Thick Fat
nature: Adamant
evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpD
[SET COMMENTS]
<p>As a wall, Snorlax is a bit lackluster in D/P, but as a Choice Bander, it is as stable as Choice Banders come. Instead of fretting over which Pokémon will stop it, Choice Band Snorlax is equipped to handle anything Curselax might not. Body Slam still supersedes Return on this set, as Choice Band Snorlax, being one of the slowest Pokémon available, prefers 30% paralysis over immediate power, unlike many of its Choice brethren. Earthquake is standard fare and doesn't have to vie for a slot anymore; however, the third and fourth slots are contested by other moves. Crunch is for Ghost-types and Fire Punch is the compromise move that hits both Levitating Ghosts like Gengar and Steels. Either may be replaced by Selfdestruct, which, due to STAB, is one of the most powerful attacks in thePokémon franchise; Selfdestruct even has a small chance of OHKOing the standard Skarmory.</p>
<p>Snorlax is outrunning little if anything, so instead of Speed, EVs have been invested in its Special Defense. This way, Snorlax maintains a reasonable degree of special survivability with which to switch in against special attackers; Thick Fat furthers that goal.</p>
[Other Options]
<p>Pursuit is a very good move to essentially trap Gengar, Mismagius, and many Psychics, who have good reason to fear Snorlax, but is unfortunately illegal with both Selfdestruct and Fire Punch. Ice Punch significantly hurts Garchomp and Salamence, and ThunderPunch annihilates Gyarados, but neither is extremely useful on Snorlax. Zen Headbutt is super effective on Gengar and Weezing, but will not OHKO the latter before it uses Haze and is merely a less accurate Crunch replacement for the former. Focus Punch delivers a very powerful hit on Rhyperior and Bronzong, and OHKOes Tyranitar, but generally is outclassed by Earthquake or Fire Punch. Instead of attacking Metagross and Tyranitar directly, Snorlax can also make them faint through its massive HP and Counter; Snorlax will usually survive any physical hit that isn't Fighting type or boosted more than once.</p>
<p>Snorlax gets Whirlwind in D/P, but as an offensive wall, it is usually much better suited to killing its opposition than blowing their boosts away. Amnesia and Charm can lighten the hits Snorlax receives, but Snorlax would much rather Curse against physical hits and just attack special attackers; Charm can force a few switches to gain Stealth Rock and Spikes damage, though. Belly Drum is an explosive alternative to Curse, but unfortunately Snorlax is, as already noted several times, extremely slow, and its Defense is just passable. However, along with Block, a timely Belly Drum can be deadly for the opposition once all Ghosts have been murdered by Pursuit. Yawn is another move that can force switches and works well with Belly Drum.</p>
<p>As expected for a Normal-type, Snorlax receives a host of special attacks to use off its pitiful base 65 Special Attack. Other than Fire Blast, Ice Beam and Surf are the only ones that would possibly have any practical application. Ice Beam can score an unexpected KO on Gliscor and Garchomp, but Surf hits Rhyperior decently even in Sandstorm conditions and thoroughly guts it if such conditions are nonexistent. However, it does at maximum, assuming Snorlax has no Special Attack EVs, a pathetic 23% on Tyranitar.</p>
[EVs]
<p>Snorlax should generally focus on buffering its HP and Special Defense, and sprinkle a little bit in Defense on the Curse and Sleep Talk sets. Note that unlike most others, Snorlax doesn't derive its best defensive combination by maximizing HP, as its HP is titanic compared to its Defense and Special Defense. However, the Choice Band version should also maximize its Attack, whereas offensive EVs are unnecessary on other sets.</p>
[Opinion]
<p>Snorlax, once among the most dominant Pokémon in the entire game, has taken a dramatic fall from grace in D/P, with the advent of extremely powerful special attackers like Azelf and Porygon-Z that essentially necessitate the use of sturdier special walls like Blissey. Focus Blast or Aura Sphere from competent special attackers Snorlax could previously wall, such as Gengar and Alakazam, has taken it down another notch. Strong physical attacks responsible for the renewed popularity of Machamp, Heracross, and others have limited the pool of Pokémon Snorlax can switch in on safely.</p>
<p>However, Snorlax still has a place in many teams, as when it is the last Pokémon, it becomes incredibly difficult for stall teams to take down. Paralysis from Body Slam incapacitates many opponents as always, and Thick Fat allows Snorlax to become among the most reliable counters to Fire and Ice-types.</p>
[Counters]
<p>Snorlax is nowhere as impregnable as it was during previous generations, and therefore has many potential counters; note that whatever counters Curselax tends to counter the Sleep Talk set as well. Strong Fighting-types that can survive a Body Slam tend to work excellently. Choice Band Heracross, Machamp, and Gallade's Close Combats will always OHKO the standard Curselax even after one Curse. If Curselax doesn't have Crunch or Fire Punch, Gengar and Mismagius are totally impervious to its assaults and Focus Blast or Calm Mind up, respectively. If it doesn't have Earthquake or Fire Punch, Metagross can switch in on a Body Slam (beware of paralysis) or Crunch and 2HKO with Choice Banded Meteor Mash, assuming Snorlax uses Curse immediately after the first Meteor Mash. The same follows for Choice Band Tyranitar regarding sets without Earthquake.</p>
<p>Snorlax can also be beaten by special attackers other than Ghosts. If it doesn't have Earthquake or Fire Punch, even Curselax falls to Calm Mind Jirachi, whose high Defense and Steel typing shield it from Crunch. Suicune with Roar can stat up alongside Snorlax and Roar it out whenever it gets too many boosts. Both physical and special Lucario will triumph against Snorlax that elect to have Crunch as the auxiliary move; the physical versions will often OHKO with Close Combat assuming Snorlax doesn't have any Curses, and the special versions with Choice Specs easily 2HKO with Aura Sphere regardless.</p>
<p>Skarmory's high Defense lets it take on any Snorlax with ease except those carrying Fire Blast while it lays down Spikes or Stealth Rock and Whirlwinds Snorlax out when it becomes uncomfortably laden with Curses, but can't do any real damage against it and therefore loses if Snorlax is the last Pokémon. Weezing, on the other hand, trades reliable healing and field-affecting moves for Haze, which wipes out Snorlax's Curses at any time, and disregard for Fire Blast. Gliscor can Taunt to stop Snorlax from Cursing in the short term; if it has Swords Dance, it can set up and Baton Pass to a more powerful attacker.</p>
