Could a fully physical team work?

[Bone Ronin]

Well Gliscor really doesn't like Gyarados' Waterfall and it doesn't take intimidate well. It may wall three pokemon but gyarados does make it switch out.

You also drastically overstate the presence of Weezing with Haze. It is a problem but most Weezing carry WOW, Fire Blast, Thunderbolt, Pain Split for coverage. Any non Haze weezing is beaten one on one by curselax.

Haze varients are tricky and pretty much need to be taken out by either Spore, like you said, or leech seed. Other annoyances are curselax paralysis that can cause weezing to FP to death. Not the best plan but within the rules its the best we can do with what we have.

I also don't think you give enough respect to breloom's spore. Once he spores he subs, and can sub seed the walls you mentioned all day with impunity. Gliscor doesn't really wall breloom behind a sub unless it packs speed Ev's and then Gyarados come in anyway and gliscor's defensive capabilities are sacrificed.

Most Swampert aren't trouble for Gyara unless they pack Stone Edge, or HP Electric. In the former case Forretress can set up SR, in the latter Snorlax can curse up or Body Slam threatening Para.

I know that the team has flaws but with all the physical walls out there when the one that gives the most problems is weezing I think that's progress. We haven't even tried to switch out pokemon to take out weezing yet. Putting in Metagross over Hera gives the option of thunderpunch for Scarm and Zen Heasbutt off of STAB for weezing.

Lets try to post ideas to make the idea feasible instead of just tearing ideas down.

 

[NSFW]

Metagross
Tyranitar
Heracross
Garchomp
Gyarados
Salamence
Infernape
Snorlax
Lucario
Weavile
Mamoswine
Medicham
Electivire
Dragonite

Why is everything so difficult? You could probably win if you slap 5 of those Pokes together, slap on a Choice Band/Life Orb to all of them, add a Wishing Jirachi, and have fun.

It's not difficult, but you can also slap 5 UU/BL Pokemon and sometimes win as well.

What Starman is basically asking is, can a all Physical Team work as well as say his all Special Team. Myself and a few others are arguing no. No one is saying it can't win a few or even a fair share amount of battles though.

If you tiered it, in terms of effectiveness though, I'd order it as:

Well Balanced Team/Stall OU team
All Special OU team
Balanced B/L team
All Physical OU team
Well Balanced UU team

Well Gliscor really doesn't like Gyarados' Waterfall and it doesn't take intimidate well. It may wall three pokemon but gyarados does make it switch out.

Gliscor isn't staying in on Gyarados and doesn't have business switching in either. I also think, push comes to shove, in a match up where Gyarados hasn't DDanced, Gliscor with Stone Edge would win the match. Don't quote me on it though.

You also drastically overstate the presence of Weezing with Haze. It is a problem but most Weezing carry WOW, Fire Blast, Thunderbolt, Pain Split for coverage. Any non Haze weezing is beaten one on one by curselax.

Haze varients are tricky and pretty much need to be taken out by either Spore, like you said, or leech seed. Other annoyances are curselax paralysis that can cause weezing to FP to death. Not the best plan but within the rules its the best we can do with what we have.

<insert any other bulky pokemon packing roar e.g. Swampert>. It doesn't have to be Weezing, and if Weezing isn't carrying Haze, they have a hazer or pseudo hazer somewhere else. Otherwise they have a flaw in their team, or have accounted for it somewhere else.

I also don't think you give enough respect to breloom's spore. Once he spores he subs, and can sub seed the walls you mentioned all day with impunity. Gliscor doesn't really wall breloom behind a sub unless it packs speed Ev's and then Gyarados come in anyway and gliscor's defensive capabilities are sacrificed.

Oh trust me, I respect the spore. I hate Breloom with a passion.

If Gliscor is forcing you to switch out though, it's doing its job. Breloom isn't if it's not aggresively taking down enemies. Gyarados can switch in all day, but whose winning the battle? My duo of Pokemon designed to take hits? Or your Duo of Pokemon designed to set up and dish out? If your switching in Gyarados, and I'm switching in Swampert, and you're Breloom is taking a Ice Attack to the face everytime he's coming in to scare away Swampert, whose winning the match? That's what walls do O_o.

Most Swampert aren't trouble for Gyara unless they pack Stone Edge, or HP Electric. In the former case Forretress can set up SR, in the latter Snorlax can curse up or Body Slam threatening Para.

That doesn't add up though. In my case my Swampert is always going to be carrying edge. Why? Because if I'm packing Gliscor as my ONLY Physical wall, I have a Gyara weakness, and I'm going to cover it one way or another.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt though. Lets take Swampert out of the picture and put in Mesprit instead, carrying Thunderbolt, Psychic, Ice Beam and U-Turn. Mesprit counters Garchomp, Gyara and half walls Breloom (ice beam "might" not kill a Sub, which would cause a problem obviously). Hera is half scared to walk in as well, given that if Mesprit predits said switch, it's taking a Psychic to the face.

I know that the team has flaws but with all the physical walls out there when the one that gives the most problems is weezing I think that's progress. We haven't even tried to switch out pokemon to take out weezing yet. Putting in Metagross over Hera gives the option of thunderpunch for Scarm and Zen Heasbutt off of STAB for weezing.

That's what we're talking about though, how well it would work. I've never said it won't work, I just don't think it would work very well. The metagame is already skewed physical on the attacking side, because we do acknowledge that physical attacks are harder to wall completly. Hence more teams carry multiple bulky pokemon to shore up said weakness. The fastest way to get rid of those bulky's, without dying to attrition, is unfortunately special attacks.

Lets try to post ideas to make the idea feasible instead of just tearing ideas down.

The best way to make something concrete, is to have someone bring it down, and force you to rebuild it.

I don't think i've been overly negative. Starman asked if it could work. All I'm saying is yes, but it's facing a lot more obstacles then his special team was. Special team had to overcome one huge one, Blissey. It's huge, but predictable, and you can work with that. Physical has to deal with the dozens of choice in pure physical walls, and then the dozen of choices in bulky Pokemon, shoring up whatever the main walls weakness is.

 

[Thorns]

You see, there was this thing in Advance called a CB Team. It consisted of 4-5 CB'ers, Magneton and a Wisher. I really can't pull myself to use full physical, but I can use 5 CB'ers and a Magnezone.

 

[teekay]

I think some people are forgetting that "all physical" doesn't preclude status and pseudo-status, or field affecting moves. Most physical walls can be broken down by toxic, spikes, and stealth rock. Your biggest problem will just be making sure that you are always threatening enough that Blissey or some other cleric doesn't want to risk using aromatherapy. In other words, it doesn't have to be just a constant offensive onslaught.

The team can also be designed to open things up. A common strategy is to remove the things that wall a Pokemon to free it up for a sweep. Since not all physical walls wall every physical Pokemon this strategy is just as valid on our theoretical all-physical team. Someone was mentioning how Gliscor totally walls Heracross, for example. Well, then here's my strategy: kill Gliscor (or Weezing, or Hippowdon, or whatever they are going to use), and then begin the Hera slaughter. Design your other attackers to completely mess those walls up, and use poison, burn, and stealth rock to discourage switches.

 

[ThaPhantom07]

CB Adamant Garchomp rips through physical walls like no tomorrow and even some Steel walls. Depends on how heavily the defense EVs on something like Bronzong are spread. I've actually 2HKO'd a Bronzong with CB Outrage (It might have been special defense oriented. I don't know). The reactions you get when you take down the opponents physical wall in 2 hits is amazing though.

 

[obi]

I'd be more apt to use Swords Dance Life Orb Garchomp as a physical wall breaker. Fire Fang, EQ, Dragon / Rock move

 

[X-Act]

I guess you'd have more success with a fully physical team than with a fully special one. Skarmory doesn't like switching into random Stone Edge or Close Combat too often. Hippowdon wouldn't be able to switch into a Waterfall well, etc.

 

[Hyra]

Are you guys honestly forgetting TTar?

It can 2HKO every physical wall in the game!

These following damage calculations are from Max Atk Adamant CBTar onto things with Max/Max+ Hp/Def.

Stone Edge on Skarmory:
Damage: 158 - 186
Damage: 47.31% - 55.69%

Stone Edge on Forretress:
Damage: 158 - 186
Damage: 44.63% - 52.54%

Stone Edge on Gliscor:
Damage: 172 - 202
Damage: 48.59% - 57.06%

Stone Edge on Weezing:
Damage: 177 - 208
Damage: 52.99% - 62.28%

Stone Edge on Suicune:
Damage: 182 - 214
Damage: 45.05% - 52.97%
Earthquake on Steelix:
Damage: 161 - 189
Damage: 45.48% - 53.39%

Earthquake on Lucario: (lol Max/Max+ Lucario)
Damage: 333 - 392
Damage: 96.80% - 113.95%

Crunch on Suicune:
Damage: 146 - 172
Damage: 36.14% - 42.57%
After drop:
Damage: 218 - 256
Damage: 53.96% - 63.37%

Crunch on Gliscor:
Damage: 138 - 162
Damage: 38.98% - 45.76%
After drop:
Damage: 205 - 242
Damage: 57.91% - 68.36%

Crunch on Weezing:
Damage: 142 - 167
Damage: 42.51% - 50.00%
After drop:
Damage: 211 - 249
Damage: 63.17% - 74.55%

Crunch on Bronzong:
Damage: 145 - 170
Damage: 42.90% - 50.30%
After drop:
Damage: 216 - 254
Damage: 63.91% - 75.15%

Crunch on Hippowdon:
Damage: 157 - 185
Damage: 37.38% - 44.05%
After drop:
Damage: 234 - 276
Damage: 55.71% - 65.71%
I think that covers them all. Suicune or Gliscor stand the best chance of walling it, and Suicune needs to rest to recover. If you are really that afraid of Gliscor, you can run Ice Fang. Same goes for Focus Punch if you are afraid of Steelix. Also, one layer of Stealth Rock (prefered to hit floaters), Toxic Spikes, or Spikes makes these all guarenteed 2HKOs (except for Bronzong). Also remember that Stone Edge can crit and either OHKO any of the above with Stealth Rock (and Weezing without it).

 

[Yoko Rains]

Just wondering, why do you want a completely Physical team? Just curious lol, I remember you made a thread a while back on a completely Special team.

 

[Saturn]

It's not difficult, but you can also slap 5 UU/BL Pokemon and sometimes win as well.

What Starman is basically asking is, can a all Physical Team work as well as say his all Special Team. Myself and a few others are arguing no. No one is saying it can't win a few or even a fair share amount of battles though.

If you tiered it, in terms of effectiveness though, I'd order it as:

Well Balanced Team/Stall Team
All Special Team
All Physical Team
Well Balanced B/L/UU team.

Woh woah. Where did UU/BL come from? The topic is about OU teams. BL/UU is a whole other matter entirely...
Back to the topic. IMO, Physical teams will not work because of the simple fact that I carry two walls that complement each other physically... Than two spec. walls. Everything physical is simply much more easily stalled. Meh.

 

[Infernape_Kong]

Are you guys honestly forgetting TTar?

It can 2HKO every physical wall in the game!

These following damage calculations are from Max Atk Adamant CBTar onto things with Max/Max+ Hp/Def.

Stone Edge on Skarmory:
Damage: 158 - 186
Damage: 47.31% - 55.69%

Uh, you have a chance at 2HKO'ing Skarm but he has a faster Base Speed and can Roost-stall your Stone Edges away.

Stone Edge on Forretress:
Damage: 158 - 186
Damage: 44.63% - 52.54%

That's not a 2HKO with Leftovers. Tip: Factoring Leftovers, you need to do 53% or better to 2HKO.

Stone Edge on Gliscor:
Damage: 172 - 202
Damage: 48.59% - 57.06%

And when it starts Roost-stalling your Stone Edges away, then what?

Stone Edge on Weezing:
Damage: 177 - 208
Damage: 52.99% - 62.28%

Stone Edge on Suicune:
Damage: 182 - 214
Damage: 45.05% - 52.97%

Earthquake on Steelix:
Damage: 161 - 189
Damage: 45.48% - 53.39%

Earthquake on Lucario: (lol Max/Max+ Lucario)
Damage: 333 - 392
Damage: 96.80% - 113.95%

Crunch on Suicune:
Damage: 146 - 172
Damage: 36.14% - 42.57%
After drop:
Damage: 218 - 256
Damage: 53.96% - 63.37%

Crunch on Gliscor:
Damage: 138 - 162
Damage: 38.98% - 45.76%
After drop:
Damage: 205 - 242
Damage: 57.91% - 68.36%

Crunch on Weezing:
Damage: 142 - 167
Damage: 42.51% - 50.00%
After drop:
Damage: 211 - 249
Damage: 63.17% - 74.55%

Crunch on Bronzong:
Damage: 145 - 170
Damage: 42.90% - 50.30%
After drop:
Damage: 216 - 254
Damage: 63.91% - 75.15%

I think that covers them all. Suicune or Gliscor stand the best chance of walling it, and Suicune needs to rest to recover. If you are really that afraid of Gliscor, you can run Ice Fang. Same goes for Focus Punch if you are afraid of Steelix. Also, one layer of Stealth Rock (prefered to hit floaters), Toxic Spikes, or Spikes makes these all guarenteed 2HKOs (except for Bronzong). Also remember that Stone Edge can crit and either OHKO any of the above with Stealth Rock (and Weezing without it).

You're forgetting Hippowdon, and lots of teams carry the hippo specifically FOR T-tar.

 

[Fenikkusu]

Woh woah. Where did UU/BL come from? The topic is about OU teams. BL/UU is a whole other matter entirely...
Back to the topic. IMO, Physical teams will not work because of the simple fact that I carry two walls that complement each other physically... Than two spec. walls. Everything physical is simply much more easily stalled. Meh.

I think the point was that you can use UU/BL teams in OU, they just aren't going to be as effective overall as a more balanced team, kind of like purely physical teams.

 

[NSFW]

I think the point was that you can use UU/BL teams in OU, they just aren't going to be as effective overall as a more balanced team, kind of like purely physical teams.

Thank you. That was my exact point, but more so that a pure physical team isn't going to be as effective as a pure special team.

I wouldn't dare try to say a pure physical team is not as good as a well balanced team. We already know that already, and that's not the point of the thread.

 

[Mood4food77]

it's not as easy as a fully special team, for the fact taht there are many more physical walls than special walls

special walls include blissey, milotic, snorlax, tentacruel, regice, gardevoir, gallade, togekiss

physical walls include skarmory, donphan, hippowdan, weezing, steelix, regirock, cloyster, forretress, metagross, leafeon, tangrowth, gliscor, slowbro, torterra

mixed walls include bronzong, registeel, cresselia, dusknoir, spiritomb

so, also with physical walls, a lot of them have a great attack stat to back them up, making their use greater than special walls (outside of blissey), also mixed walls appear more often than special walls because they can do pretty much whatever they want, so in reality, a full special team has to find a way to deal with blissey, a full physical team has to find a way to deal with a mass amount of pokes


oh and htose pokes are the common ones in standard play

 

[Suburvia]

I seriously doubt that this would be anywhere even remotely close to as effective as a fully special team. The reason that's so effective is because once you kill Blissey, it's basically a free sweepfest. That's not the case with Physical attackers. Most people are usually much more prepared for all of the physical threats than special ones. I mean, have you ever made a team without packing counters to Garchomp, Tyranitar, Gyarados, etc.? Didn't think so. On the special side, you could easily throw Blissey on your team and go, "Special threats walled. =]" Then, when Blissey dies, you fall apart. Whereas if Gyara manages to take down Skarm, you still have three T-Bolters to back it up. Everybody has a billion Ice moves on their team. Everybody knows how to take on T-Tar. Seriously, people are just too well prepared for physical threats.

Now, with that out of the way, it could definitely work. It wouldn't work as well as an all-special or normal, balanced team, but it would work. And as for my suggestions. . .

Staraptor. This thing kills stuff. It can 2HKO Gliscor with Adamant CB Brave Bird. Doesn't that bring a smile to your face? It also defeats Dusknoir with relative ease, Cressy is 3HKO'd, but I'm pretty sure you can 2HKO with Max/Max damage. Skarm doesn't like repeated CC's, and I doubt Forretress and Scizor will like switching into CC either. Weezing is probably 2HKO'd (not sure), since Gliscor is. Hippowdon can probably take it on with relative ease, especially factoring in SS + Recoil damage. Which is Staraptor's major drawback; Recoil is going to be quickly taking large chunks out of your health, and with a SR weakness, that's never a good thing. Star needs Wish support if you're looking to switch it in more than two or three times, if even that many. But it can still dish out serious damage to some premier physical walls and pretty much anything else that doesn't resist BB, and what resists BB takes at least neutral from CC. Staraptor's great =D

That's really the only suggestion I have, but it's a good one. Staraptor's amazing (Intimidate always helps =D). Good luck if you decide to go through with it. . .

 

[Rodger]

Staraptor. This thing kills stuff. It can 2HKO Gliscor with Adamant CB Brave Bird. Doesn't that bring a smile to your face? It also defeats Dusknoir with relative ease, Cressy is 3HKO'd, but I'm pretty sure you can 2HKO with Max/Max damage. Skarm doesn't like repeated CC's, and I doubt Forretress and Scizor will like switching into CC either. Weezing is probably 2HKO'd (not sure), since Gliscor is. Hippowdon can probably take it on with relative ease, especially factoring in SS + Recoil damage. Which is Staraptor's major drawback; Recoil is going to be quickly taking large chunks out of your health, and with a SR weakness, that's never a good thing. Star needs Wish support if you're looking to switch it in more than two or three times, if even that many. But it can still dish out serious damage to some premier physical walls and pretty much anything else that doesn't resist BB, and what resists BB takes at least neutral from CC. Staraptor's great =D

That's really the only suggestion I have, but it's a good one. Staraptor's amazing (Intimidate always helps =D). Good luck if you decide to go through with it. . .

I used to use a Staraptor. Its seriously underestimated. Even the walls it doesn't 2HKO are often 2HKO'd with SR and/or Spike support, like Hippie. Brave Bird is actually better against Forry/Scizor than Close Combat since it still hits neutral but gets STAB. Any kind of damage on a wall not taking a resisted attack from Staraptor will be the end of its walling days.

Throw in Wish Support Jirachi (or a Wish Blissey with no Ice Beam), Forretress for spin/spike, and Dusknoir for spin block and you've got a team going there. Add in maybe a Scarf'd Garchomp and a Bulky Gyarados and you're all set. Maybe 'double spike' with Forretress, using SR and Toxic Spikes to help chew through the walls. Using both would be optimal because of Hippowdon obviously, who doens't take any noteworthy damage from SR. Being poisoned would remove its ability to just Slack Off Staraptor's hits so easily.

 

[CZ]

It is doable, but watch out for a very stallish teams. Lots of Physical walls are around at this time (Gliscor, Skarmory, Hippo, and Weezing (personal favorite). You may want to pack a BoltBeamer in case. Maybe a Slowvro with Slack Off/Psychic/Hidden Power Electric, and Ice Beam, (Shut up about the no STAB set, it is only a physical wall breaker) to handle the walls listed above.

 

[Aeroblacktyl]

I seriously doubt that this would be anywhere even remotely close to as effective as a fully special team. The reason that's so effective is because once you kill Blissey, it's basically a free sweepfest. That's not the case with Physical attackers. Most people are usually much more prepared for all of the physical threats than special ones. I mean, have you ever made a team without packing counters to Garchomp, Tyranitar, Gyarados, etc.? Didn't think so. On the special side, you could easily throw Blissey on your team and go, "Special threats walled. =]" Then, when Blissey dies, you fall apart. Whereas if Gyara manages to take down Skarm, you still have three T-Bolters to back it up. Everybody has a billion Ice moves on their team. Everybody knows how to take on T-Tar. Seriously, people are just too well prepared for physical threats.

Now, with that out of the way, it could definitely work. It wouldn't work as well as an all-special or normal, balanced team, but it would work. And as for my suggestions. . .

Staraptor. This thing kills stuff. It can 2HKO Gliscor with Adamant CB Brave Bird. Doesn't that bring a smile to your face? It also defeats Dusknoir with relative ease, Cressy is 3HKO'd, but I'm pretty sure you can 2HKO with Max/Max damage. Skarm doesn't like repeated CC's, and I doubt Forretress and Scizor will like switching into CC either. Weezing is probably 2HKO'd (not sure), since Gliscor is. Hippowdon can probably take it on with relative ease, especially factoring in SS + Recoil damage. Which is Staraptor's major drawback; Recoil is going to be quickly taking large chunks out of your health, and with a SR weakness, that's never a good thing. Star needs Wish support if you're looking to switch it in more than two or three times, if even that many. But it can still dish out serious damage to some premier physical walls and pretty much anything else that doesn't resist BB, and what resists BB takes at least neutral from CC. Staraptor's great =D

That's really the only suggestion I have, but it's a good one. Staraptor's amazing (Intimidate always helps =D). Good luck if you decide to go through with it. . .

See, the issue with the whole every team counters all those things is, what team counters EACH AND EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM. For example, you can only stack so many walls on your team before you do absolutely no damage to them. For an example, if Cresselia is your main wall for Gyarados, what use will that be if Tyranitar is CBPursuiting it in and out, making Cresselia a no longer able Gyarados counter. If your using a team like: Dusknoir Blissey Hippowdon Skarmory Cresselia Suicune, for example, against a team like Gyarados, Garchomp, Tyranitar, Weavile, Lucario and let's say even Luxray, which would you rather take your chances on? I'd go for the all offensive team since the defensive team isn't a threat anyways.

Also with the support you're giving Staraptor, in theory you could put any sweeper in Staraptor's place with Blissey, Wish, Spikes, Dusknoir, random assortment of random damage and it'll most likely work. Also you'll probably self-KO yourself on a Stealth Rock and 2HKO'ing any full health Poke thanks to recoil.

 

[StarmanXL]

Just wondering, why do you want a completely Physical team? Just curious lol, I remember you made a thread a while back on a completely Special team.

For fun, mostly, but also because I can't seem to make a standard, non-gimmick team that works (only my gimmick teams seem to be somewhat effective, for some reason >_>).

But yes, as teekay mentioned, I'm not just gonna have a team of all-sweepers; I can still use status moves to cripple and take down walls. I mean, honestly, I've got Toxic, WoW, Stealth Rock, Spikes, Toxic Spikes, Roar, Destiny Bond, Perish Song, Baton Pass, Swords Dance, Hypnosis, Thunderwave, Taunt, Confuse Ray, Whirlwind, Haze, Yawn, Memento, and so on. Yes, I've more walls to worry about, but I think that I could possibly find a way to deal with them that isn't just beating them to hell with a physical attacker.

I must admit, though, when I made this thread, I thought people'd find this idea easier than my previous one, but...wow.

Concerning the whole Blissey thing, I don't honestly think any good player will automatically get raped by special sweepers should their special wall die. I mean, if your Gliscor is dead, does that mean your team automatically loses to Heracross? Should your team get owned because Blissey's not there to deal with the likes of Starmie? Using my special team, I've noticed I've lost way more times to being outpredicted, bad luck, or stupid mistakes than I have to being walled by something.

 

[Hyra]

You're forgetting Hippowdon, and lots of teams carry the hippo specifically FOR T-tar.

Oops, thats why I including the defence drops on Crunch, specifically for Hippowdon.

Crunch on Hippowdon:
Damage: 157 - 185
Damage: 37.38% - 44.05%
After drop:
Damage: 234 - 276
Damage: 55.71% - 65.71%

Not as close as the others, and Hippo has Slack Off, but Hippo fails against any Water-based physical attacker (especially Gyarados). Grass (K)not so much, but only because Hippo carries Ice Fang usually.

 

[Mood4food77]

well, if you only have one poke who can handle heracross, then yes, your team dies to heracross once it's gone

i'm pretty sure the hippo dies to grass knot more than it would to waterfall, it's fat and it's weak to it, also a special move which is the lower defense on the hippo

doesn't matter how high gyra's attack is

 

[cim]

STAB Volt Tackle Raichu does something like 55-75% to a Skarmory (with lefties on raichu!), not to mention it's fucking badass. Stuff like Gliscor and Weezing can wall it well, since Volt Tackle and Focus Punch is roughly its entire physical movepool. Encore can mess them both up though.

I know how barely relevant that is, but it's just fucking cool.

Raichu @ Leftovers
Substiute/Encore
Focus Punch
Volt Tackle
Double-Edge/Encore/Quick Attack/Natural Gift

 

[Mood4food77]

but now a volt tackle from pikachu with light ball hurts a lot...unless you're ground

 

[Aeroblacktyl]

Concerning the whole Blissey thing, I don't honestly think any good player will automatically get raped by special sweepers should their special wall die. I mean, if your Gliscor is dead, does that mean your team automatically loses to Heracross? Should your team get owned because Blissey's not there to deal with the likes of Starmie? Using my special team, I've noticed I've lost way more times to being outpredicted, bad luck, or stupid mistakes than I have to being walled by something.

That's because you don't win a battle on paper. For example, nothing can switch into Specs Aura Sphere from Lucario, but Dugtrio sure as fuck will rape it he second it kills something. That's not point in trying to make a team purely on %'s against walls, as something like Infernape wil just come in, outspeed your whole team and rape it anyways.

 

[Mood4food77]

dugtrio rapes nape....he's faster unless nape's scarfed

so dugtrio as a lead (and hope it isn't a flying/levitate lead), would be a good choice