NU Armaldo [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

[Ares]

The ability and spread need to be changed to Swift Swim and either max speed or a custom spread. As well as updating the rest of the analysis to reflect the new set. Pls do ASAP

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Sorry! Will update soon!

 

[ryan]

Somewhere, probably the Overview, you can mention that Armaldo is good on rain for its ability to take on bulky Grass-types that rain teams often struggle to break. It 2HKOs even physically defensive Vileplume with X-Scissor if you have up Stealth Rock and does it with Stone Edge without Stealth Rock. Virizion takes ~75% min from X-Scissor, and it 2HKOs physically defensive Tangela without Stealth Rock like 90% of the time or some shit. Every other relevant Grass-type is weak to X-Scissor and not nearly as bulky as Tangela. It's also strong against bulky Water-types (Stone Edge almost always 2HKO on Prinplup after Stealth Rock, 3HKO on Seismitoad, bodies Mantine and Pelipper, etc).

No more Kabutops means Swords Dance isn't utterly outclassed. Honestly, I don't think I'd even use Rapid Spin on it in the rain. I'd rather just use SD + three attacks. It does compete some with Carracosta, but Armaldo isn't weak to Grass and can handle most Grass-types more reliably unboosted because of X-Scissor. Knock Off is pretty awful on it, with or without Rapid Spin. Swords Dance / X-Scissor / Stone Edge / Aqua Tail sounds best to me.

QC thoughts?

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Yeah! In all my testing I pretty much never used Rapid Spin when the rain was up because attacking was always the better option. I've found that Armaldo is quite the Virizion check in the rain, it's nice to see that Bug STAB carves a decent niche for Armaldo.

 

[Punchshroom]

The problem of forgoing Rapid Spin on Swift Swim Armaldo is that it now faces competition from other Swift Swimmers in the process, most notably Beartic whose Ice STAB hits a greater number of Grass-types super effectively (namely Virizion, Gourgeist, Vileplume, etc.), nullifying Armaldo's niche. So yeah, even without Kabutops in the tier Armaldo still manages to find itself outclassed if it drops Rapid Spin.

 

[CanadianWifier]

Hey WhinoTheRhino, please remove mentions of banned Pokemon, specifically Virizion and Mega Steelix from this! :)

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Thanks for the heads up CanadianWifier . I'm a bit confused though. Why are there tier changes now?

 

[boltsandbombers]

Thanks for the heads up CanadianWifier . I'm a bit confused though. Why are there tier changes now?

Mega steelix and Helioisk were banned, and Virizion, steelix, and qwilfish moved to RU because of usage.

Mont edit: there are "quick" tier shifts every month if a pokemon has a super high usage (higher than 6.7%) or if its super low (below 1.5%). Normal ones are still every 3 months

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

But I thought tier changes only happen every 3 months?

 

[boltsandbombers]

But I thought tier changes only happen every 3 months?

They changed the process so that there are now quick rises and drops every month, I think it may have been like that in the past at one point.

 

[CanadianWifier]

Thanks for the heads up CanadianWifier . I'm a bit confused though. Why are there tier changes now?

Smogon recently adopted a monthy "quick drop" and "quick rise" thing, to keep the fluidity of the tiers everchanging. Post is here.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Oh! Thanks for the explanation!

 

[CanadianWifier]

So did we ever come to a consensus for what the main set will be in terms of moves / coverage?
Having a slash for move 2 and 4, but not for 3 looks strange, so move Aqua Tail to the second slot if that's the way it's staying.

Also expanding team options would be nice: )
What appreciates the rapid spin support? give some examples that work well on a team with armaldo.

formatting is a bit off for C&C, check other analysis' for the correct spacing! (and remove bullet points from C&C)

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

I added things and fixed the formatting. As for moves, I think the current moveset is the best option. Rapid Spin is obvs mandatory, and so is Aqua Tail for its power under Rain and to prevent getting walled by Fighting-types. X-Scissor is important to check Grass-types that other Rain team members dislike, and Knock Off is extremely useful for its utility, good coverage, and it also hits spinblockers. Stone Edge has its uses, but I'm not really sure where I should slash it if at all.

 

[Punchshroom]

In that case your 'Moves' section should match the move order.

In OO, you can point out a defensive spread to discourage its use, stating the reasons it is bad (bad hazard weakness, very few resists, outclassed by Sandslash).

With Knock Off, Armaldo can deal significant damage to offensive spinblockers, removing their item at the same time

This is misleading, because Armaldo does not need Knock Off to beat Mismagius and Rotom (as you yourself stated in 'Moves'). Just mention that Armaldo has the power to break through most spinblockers in general.

Rain Dance users and other Swift Swim sweepers are examples of rain team members.

Such as...?

Ferroseed and Poliwrath have good synergy with Armaldo, as they both resist all of Armaldo's weaknesses.

I don't know how common these two are on Rain teams (Poliwrath at least does fit somewhat), but you can make a note on the other Swift Swimmers also covering its weaknesses, aka Ludicolo and Seismitoad.

 

[marilli]

• Hazard users have to be on a team with Armaldo. If the player has no hazards of their own, then any of the Water/Flying Pokemon with Defog can easily fit on a Rain team and do Armaldo's job better.

Not having water typing isn't actually that bad on rain because there's already a lot of water-type swift swimmers that are shoo-in for rain (like Ludicolo / Seismitoad). Also even with defog you'd really want hazards on rain offense anyways because you want to break sashes and sturdy. Your comment suggests that in a rainteam with defog you can get away with no hazards, which isn't true, but I digress.

• Pokemon weak to Stealth Rock such as Sneasel or Pokemon that carry a Focus Sash such as Gorebyss appreciate Armaldo's ability to spin.

Gorebyss doesn't usually carry Focus Sash. Gorebyss / Huntail has above-average bulk for NU, surviving most unboosted neutral hits.

Mention that also a lot of balanced teams that end up struggling against rain employ toxic spikes, and Armaldo can get rid of them if necessary.

Sorry that the qc team bogged down while Armaldo really struggled to carve a niche. Now that the directions should be pretty clear, I'll give preliminary QC 2/3 after you take all the changes and flesh out team options (as Punchshroom said above, name specific swift swimmers. It sounds obvious that Rain dance Uxie, Ludicolo and Seismitoad will be on rain, but it should be stated.)

On other options I guess it's kind of similar to mentioning SR, but also mention the set you had before (slow non-rain spin set with lefties), and talk about why it isn't the best (sr weakness, bug-type removes relevant fire and flying resist, lots of competition with good rock-types for teamslot, etc.)

edit: this means that as soon as you edit your original post to add all of the above, I'll give you an OK and you can start writing.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

A QC CHECK??? I never thought I would see this day! Thanks, haha. I'll put in the changes soon, I just got back from a Spring Break trip.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

I believe I added everything I need to, give me the OK and I'll start writing!

 

[marilli]

You just got rid of example of Sash user and you should aim to add information, not subtract. Something like Jynx and Sawk are common Sash / Sturdy users.

Also when I said to mention the slow set in OO I meant 252 HP / 252 Atk set we had previously as our main choice when we had Kabutops, not 252 HP / 252 Def set. If you are set on using Armaldo out of rain, dunno why, but then 252 HP / 252 Atk bulky spin + 3 attacks set is probably best. Second best set = deserves mention in OO.

QC 2/3

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Will get this written up soon. Thanks!

 

[Blast]

WhinoTheRhino this hasn't been written in two weeks, are you still working on this?

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Yes, sorry! I can't get it done until this weekend, but it will be done then, sorry.

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

This is all written up, ready for the final QC check. Sorry if it's a bit sloppy, I've been super busy but I do want to finish this, it has been almost 8 months after all! lol...

 

[Ares]

Comments in bold

This is my first time, so, uh, here we go!
Overview
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Being the only Pokemon in NU with access to both Swift Swim and Rapid Spin, Armaldo carves himself a niche in NU as a decent Swift Swim sweeper who can support his team with hazard removal. Outclassed in a solely spinning role as well as a setup role, Armaldo must be utilized on a rain team in order to avoid being outclassed, where he can use his high speed under rain and strong offensive presence to spin and dish out strong hits. In addition to Rapid Spin, Armaldo's movepool offers unique coverage in X-Scissor that is valued on rain teams for its ability to take on Grass-types that rain teams have trouble with, such as Vileplume plume is neutral to xscissor mention another relevant grass type. Armaldo also has access to Knock Off, allowing him to break through most spinblockers. Unfortunately, Armaldo's semi-unique typing is a burden. He loses 25% when switching into the very hazards he's supposed to remove, has common weaknesses in Water- and Rock-type, and two mostly useless resistances in Normal and Poison. However, Armaldo's resistances, specifically his Normal resistance, do come in use against Normal-types such as Kangaskhan, which Armaldo can tank and spin well against.

Swift Swim Sweeper/Spinner
########
name: Offensive Swift Swim Spinner just make this spinner, not sweeper
move 1: Rapid Spin
move 2: Aqua Tail
move 3: X-Scissor
move 4: Knock Off / Stone Edge
ability: Swift Swim
item: Life Orb
evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
nature: Jolly

Moves
========

Rapid Spin is what makes Armaldo viable. Use it to support Armaldo's team with hazard removal. Aqua Tail is actually the strongest move Armaldo can use under rain, and beats the frailer spinblockers in Mismagius and Rotom. When out of rain, X-Scissor is Armaldo's most reliable move, however Armaldo generally wants to stay in the rain. X-Scissor easily deals with Grass-types that can be troublesome for rain teams. Knock Off is useful as always, removing items and dealing high damage with good coverage. Additionally, Knock Off can deal with Gourgeist, who is generally a problem for rain teams. However, Stone Edge a is a useful secondary STAB that can be used to hit Mantine, Pelipper, and Vileplume, although it suffers from lower accuracy.

Set Details
========

252 Speed EVs and a Jolly nature allow Armaldo to outspeed the likes of Swellow, Adamant Scarf Sawk, and Sneasel when under rain. 252 Attack EVs and a Life Orb are used to maximize damage output in order to sweep as efficiently as possible.

Usage Tips
========

Although Armaldo is a spinner, avoid mindlessly spamming Rapid Spin. Rain is a limited resource, and a spin should only be executed if desperately needed. when should I spin? toxic spikes are a must spin, but what about just rocks or spikes? Otherwise, Armaldo should make use of rain turns to deal as much damage as possible with his high speed and good coverage. Specifically, Armaldo can spin and tank against Kangaskhan and Kecleon, which are both bothersome threats for fellow rain sweepers. In addition, Armaldo's strong Bug STAB in X-Scissor easily deals with Grass-types that are also troublesome for rain teams. Finally, some balanced teams employ Toxic Spikes to deal with rain teams, and Armaldo can get rid of them if necessary.

Team Options
========

Being only viable in rain teams, Armaldo needs team members that make a rain team. Rain Dance users such as Uxie and other Swift Swim sweepers such as Seismitoad and Ludicolo are examples of rain team members. Additionally, Ludicolo and Seismitoad as well as Poliwrath all cover Armaldo's weaknesses well, and can fit onto rain teams. Finally, Pokemon weak to Stealth Rock such as Sneasel or Pokemon holding a Focus Sash such as Jynx also appreciate Armaldo's ability to spin.

Other Options
########

Although Armaldo has quite a wide and appealing movepool that can fill many roles, Armaldo is outclassed in all other roles he can offer. Still, these options can be used if desired. A more tanking oriented spinning set can be used, but Armaldo's weakness to Stealth Rock and mostly useless resistances make it pitiful, and both Sandslash and Claydol outclass Armaldo in this role. A Rock Polish set can be used, but Armaldo's typing leaves few chances to setup, and Crustle outclasses Armaldo in this role. Stealth Rock is an interesting option for Armaldo, but Armaldo should be firing off powerful moves instead of setting up Stealth Rock, and Armaldo finds few free turns to use Stealth Rock. Choice Band is another option that Armaldo can make use of with his high power, however Armaldo's typing and weakness to Stealth Rock let him down once again. Finally, a Swords Dance set combined with Swift Swim can be used quite decently. However, Armaldo has issues finding turns to setup, and Beartic can perform this role somewhat better.

Checks & Counters
########

**Stealth Rock make this Entry Hazards**: Being weak to the hazards he's supposed to clear, Armaldo's defensive capabilities are severely hampered by losing 25% of his health when switching in.

**Super Effective Attacks**: While Armaldo's physical bulk is decent, he is unable to make full use of it due to his exploitable weaknesses. Common physical threats such as Archeops can hit Armaldo with STAB super effective attacks, easily KOing Armaldo.

**Special Attacks**: such as?With mostly useless resistances and mediocre Special Defense, Armaldo is easily KOed by special attacks.

**Faster Pokemon**: such as? When not under Rain, Armaldo is quite slow, resulting in many Pokemon outspeeding him and KOing him before he can do anything.

**Fighting-types**: such as? Resisting both of Armaldo's STABs as well as Knock Off, Fighting-types only fear Aqua Tail, which becomes quite weak when not under rain.

Give some examples in C&C

3/3

 

[WhinoTheRhino]

Implemented changes, ready for GP now!