The MMA/Boxing/Fighting Sports Thread

[habajiga]

Alright, so we have a new champ (ty Shinryu) and that was a really good card overall. I think Jones will reclaim the title upon return, but Cormier will be much better prepared this time around and have a better chance. I think Johnson will compete for a title again, and hopefully have better cardio. Weidman needs more respect, and this fight really showed how much TRT helped Vitor, although Weidman is a huge MW Vitor looked smaller than usual in the fight.

 

[Shinryu]

2 new champs? Isn't Cormier the only new one? Weidman has been MW champ, and I'll agree he now has earned respect with solid title defenses that weren't freak injury wins vs Silva.

Arlovski's revival is impressive as well, he's gone from Glassjaw Joe to a top contender. It'd be a good comeback ending if he somehow regains the HW title.

 

[Saria]

Professional athletes gassing in 2 rounds is disgusting. Rumble might be strong as fuck, but the lack of cardio and horrendous defensive ground games means his only chance against Cormier and Jones is a quick KO. Speaking of Jones, I honestly thought Rumble had a decent shot at beating him, but after yesterday's fight I see Bones dismantling him easily.

DC's chin impressed me a fucking ton. Rumble sent him flying across the ring and he recovered instantly, unreal. Still not enough for me to consider him a real champ, what he did wasn't enough to simply ignore the fact Jones dominated him a couple months ago.

Everyone kept mentioning Vitor's experience as advantage against Weidman for some reason. Sure, he has been fighting for a fuck ton of time, but he has always been unidimensional and he loses to any wrestler that doesn't get KOd in 30 sec. Only thing Vitor has added to his game in 19 years is kicks.

 

[habajiga]

Professional athletes gassing in 2 rounds is disgusting. Rumble might be strong as fuck, but the lack of cardio and horrendous defensive ground games means his only chance against Cormier and Jones is a quick KO. Speaking of Jones, I honestly thought Rumble had a decent shot at beating him, but after yesterday's fight I see Bones dismantling him easily.

DC's chin impressed me a fucking ton. Rumble sent him flying across the ring and he recovered instantly, unreal. Still not enough for me to consider him a real champ, what he did wasn't enough to simply ignore the fact Jones dominated him a couple months ago.

Everyone kept mentioning Vitor's experience as advantage against Weidman for some reason. Sure, he has been fighting for a fuck ton of time, but he has always been unidimensional and he loses to any wrestler that doesn't get KOd in 30 sec. Only thing Vitor has added to his game in 19 years is kicks.

In terms of Rumble's grappling defense, he has pretty good takedown and ground defense actually. The reason he got dominated in that area was because as you said, he gassed. Now in terms of Vitor, I really don't know what happened. Like he has shown intelligence on the ground before, but he tried punching out of mount (lol). To be fair, being mounted by Weidman isn't the easiest situation to get out of, but Vitor shouln't have let it reach there in the first place.

 

[mirza]

Rumble gassing vs DC should be of no surprise, pro athlete or not. You can find any pro athlete who is not a wrestler (>220 lbs) and they WILL gas after wrestling DC for 2 rounds. Imagine how pitiful our NFL players would look if they didn't get a break every 10-15 seconds of action.

Also Jones didn't dominate DC. He won 4 rounds, 3 imho, in a even fight. Jones took over with superior durability and better gameplan. DC will (hopefully) use his wrestling to generate offense in the rematch, where his real chances of winning lie. Both have equal chances in the rematch imo.


Vitor's only real advantage vs Weidman was his experience and experience is vastly overrated imho. In recent years Vitor's only lost to the best of the best; Weidman, Jones, Silva, while KTFOing Bisping, Rockhold, Henderson, Franklin, Akiyama, and choking out Rumble. He's not going to be the champ anytime soon but he is a upper level gatekeeper and has a few fights left to pocket some money. Weidman is a MONSTER of a fighter and there is no shame in losing to someone like him.

Looking at the current list of middleweights and only Jacare looks like a legitimate threat to Weidman imo.

 

[Trax]

At Mexican altitude: Werdum 1, Tex Mex Velasquez 0.

Fabricio Werdum beats guys by ABC.. always be trolling.

 

[habajiga]

New champ!

 

[Shinryu]

Well I definitely wouldnt have believed it had it not happened...I still remember him mostly as a meh HW (and that shameful farce of a fight he did against Overeem), but props for becoming the new undisputed UFC HW champ.

 

[mirza]

Sup Venom.

Heavyweight division looks VERY interesting right now. Werdum, Velasquez, JDS, Miocic, Arkovski and MAYBE Overeem are all capable of beating each other.

Want to see Cain vs Miocic, vs Arlovski, vs Overeem. Will be interesting to see how Cain moves forwardm

 

[Mattapod]

Sup Venom.

Heavyweight division looks VERY interesting right now. Werdum, Velasquez, JDS, Miocic, Arkovski and MAYBE Overeem are all capable of beating each other.

Want to see Cain vs Miocic, vs Arlovski, vs Overeem. Will be interesting to see how Cain moves forwardm

unfortunately arlovski vs overeem prob wont happen since theyre training partners at jacksons here in abq.. but man would that be sick. i think theyll give the next title shot to arlovski or possibly have him fight JDS/Stipe for the #1 contender.

howbout that striking clinic joanna put on though? very impressive.

 

[Venom]

Sup Venom.

Heavyweight division looks VERY interesting right now. Werdum, Velasquez, JDS, Miocic, Arkovski and MAYBE Overeem are all capable of beating each other.

Want to see Cain vs Miocic, vs Arlovski, vs Overeem. Will be interesting to see how Cain moves forwardm

you're acting like if Velasquez doesn't come back from losses twice as hard tho lmao...literally twice as hard ask you boy JDS

300+ days out without fighting is certain to some ring rust. he was breathing hard as fuck for some reason and I'm confident he was under trained.

Other than that congratulationsto Werdum. I actually like this guy. His BJJ is superb probably one of the best to have entered a mat and I rather him have the title than that one dimensional fighter JDS.

 

[habajiga]

Very impressive performance tonight by Romero, stoppage came out of nowhere, I think with his wrestling/speed he has a good chance vs Rockhold and Weidman.
Edit: this guy is absolutely terrifying, the violence, and did you see his celebration? And that raspy voice and the post fight interview.....scary

 

[mirza]

Haha Romero's great I called this win too but had no one to brag about ;) he brought great gameplan and Machida didn't have the speed nor timing with his hands to ease any pressure from Romero. Middleweight is tough right now and Machida doesn't look his best.


As far as HW goes JDS, Arlovski,and Miocic are all lined up for title shots. All capable of beating both Werdum and Cain. JDS and Arlovski have both beaten Werdum in the past. However Stipe's the best fighter of the bunch as far as I'm concerned and is my favorite heavyweight to watch. He's going to be the champ in the next year or two.

Venom
Cain got his ass kicked. He had over a year to prepare for this fight and quite frankly it's really annoying waiting on the HW champ to fight every 2 years. He was going to get stripped sooner or later for pulling out all the damn time hence why they had to get a fucking interim champ.. He was breathing hard because Werdum owned him everywhere, gave him no free time or space, and especially made him his bitch in the clinch. Cain wasted tons of energy winging punches and trying to clinch with Werdum. The only good thing he did was land some kicks in the first. He's actually better off he went for that double leg and was tapped out because had that fight kept going it would look like Cain vs JDS 2/3 with Cain taking the beating. Look at him on the stool after the second. He was done. Stay out of Mexico Cain. You're a sea-level champ.

Funny how you excuse your favorite fighters when they look like shit. Fat ass Mark Hunt fought Werdum on SHORT NOTICE in MEXICO CITY, MEXICO, with no high altitude preparation and did better than Cain.


Almost as sad as your boy Diaz crawling away from a ground fight 3 times against GSP..Ceasar Gracie BJJ skillz

:)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 

[Mattapod]

i love machida but i dont think he has the skillset or style to contend in the modern era. his wrestling is not there and a counter punching style only works if youve got the power to back it up like chuck liddell used to. his best bet would be to adapt a style like the diaz bros and try to overwhelm people with his precision. i feel like romero couldve done what he did in the first round if he really wanted to. hell be a great match for weidman and could possibly beat him

 

[Venom]

Venom
Cain got his ass kicked. He had over a year to prepare for this fight and quite frankly it's really annoying waiting on the HW champ to fight every 2 years. He was going to get stripped sooner or later for pulling out all the damn time hence why they had to get a fucking interim champ.. He was breathing hard because Werdum owned him everywhere, gave him no free time or space, and especially made him his bitch in the clinch. Cain wasted tons of energy winging punches and trying to clinch with Werdum. The only good thing he did was land some kicks in the first. He's actually better off he went for that double leg and was tapped out because had that fight kept going it would look like Cain vs JDS 2/3 with Cain taking the beating. Look at him on the stool after the second. He was done. Stay out of Mexico Cain. You're a sea-level champ.

Funny how you excuse your favorite fighters when they look like shit. Fat ass Mark Hunt fought Werdum on SHORT NOTICE in MEXICO CITY, MEXICO, with no high altitude preparation and did better than Cain.


Almost as sad as your boy Diaz crawling away from a ground fight 3 times against GSP..Ceasar Gracie BJJ skillz

:)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

lmao

mirza you sure one do express you hate for mexis really well haha! It's ok though we didn't mean to take your lunch money all throughout school bro, we just didn't have enough.

During the time Cain was off the was literally babying his knee probably more than half the time. I already know you don't train so why bother explain how just taking a few days off of training can seriously affect cardio, imagine months.

Also you are dumb as hell if you thought Werdum completely dominated Velasquez. The first round Werdum was catching those hands and was back pedaling; Cain never back pedals.

It's all good though he will come back, and you know it in your heart.

 

[VuvuzelaBzz]

Don't worry Venom, even if Cain doesn't find his old form, rising Mexican star Giblert Melendez is ready to dominate his division.

Hide

 

[Saria]

lmao

mirza you sure one do express you hate for mexis really well haha! It's ok though we didn't mean to take your lunch money all throughout school bro, we just didn't have enough.

During the time Cain was off the was literally babying his knee probably more than half the time. I already know you don't train so why bother explain how just taking a few days off of training can seriously affect cardio, imagine months.

Also you are dumb as hell if you thought Werdum completely dominated Velasquez. The first round Werdum was catching those hands and was back pedaling; Cain never back pedals.

It's all good though he will come back, and you know it in your heart.

Mate, have you ever trained? Cardio is the easiest thing to regain after that kind of injuries, and he had more than enough time to work on it, easily more than half a year. Cain's main issue was that he was stupid enough to think training at sea level would prepare him for Mexico's altitude, which was stupid as fuck. Doesn't matter how hard you train, if your body isn't adapted to the altitude you are fucked. Werdum was smart and had a 2 months camp in Mexico.

The fact Werdum wasn't scared to stand and bang, and that Cain was too scared to take him to the ground didn't help.

"Werdum was backpedaling"

???????????????????????????????????

Such a shitty attempt at inserting a shitty buzzword into the discussion. You should at least google the definition of back pedaling

Cain was pushing Werdum against the fence to force his pace and grind him out, because that's what he does in literally every single one of his fights. Werdum was prepared for that and defended himself well in the clinch. They both traded shots and both were getting tagged regularly, Cain got cut 1:30 min in and 4 min in he was looking woobly af after eating jabs.

This is Cain in r1

This is Werdum

Not only Cain was visibly more damage, he was already struggling to breath. Werdum was relaxed. Cain might have won the round in points, due to total strikes + TDs, but it wasn't a good round for him.

After R1 Werdum shat on Cain, and there's no point in even discussing R2 and R3 because they weren't remotely close.

 

[Mattapod]

Mate, have you ever trained? Cardio is the easiest thing to regain after that kind of injuries, and he had more than enough time to work on it, easily more than half a year. Cain's main issue was that he was stupid enough to think training at sea level would prepare him for Mexico's altitude, which was stupid as fuck. Doesn't matter how hard you train, if your body isn't adapted to the altitude you are fucked. Werdum was smart and had a 2 months camp in Mexico.

shes entirely correct here. when i first moved to albuquerque from california i was conditioned to easily go 6x6 min rounds sparring with 1 minute rest periods. as soon as i got here and went to my first practice i was sucking wind 3 mins into the warmup. you lose your breath faster and it takes exponentially longer to regain it for a number of reasons. training at altitude increases your red blood cell count and makes oxygem delivery significantly more efficient. the amount of iron in your blood changes too.

its not viable for most, but if youre fighting at that elite elite level, high altitude training is mandatory. they have the money to fly their camp up there, and to not do that is a mistake. i went back to sea level last week and my cardio was thru the roof as there is 60% more oxygen down there as opposed to where im at which is 1 mile up. mexico city is evem higher than that.

i really like cain, but there was no way he was winning that fight based on altitude alone. his style depends on cardio and he shot himself in the foot staying at aka for his camp

 

[Venom]

Mate, have you ever trained? Cardio is the easiest thing to regain after that kind of injuries, and he had more than enough time to work on it, easily more than half a year. Cain's main issue was that he was stupid enough to think training at sea level would prepare him for Mexico's altitude, which was stupid as fuck. Doesn't matter how hard you train, if your body isn't adapted to the altitude you are fucked. Werdum was smart and had a 2 months camp in Mexico.

The fact Werdum wasn't scared to stand and bang, and that Cain was too scared to take him to the ground didn't help.

"Werdum was backpedaling"

???????????????????????????????????

Such a shitty attempt at inserting a shitty buzzword into the discussion. You should at least google the definition of back pedaling

Cain was pushing Werdum against the fence to force his pace and grind him out, because that's what he does in literally every single one of his fights. Werdum was prepared for that and defended himself well in the clinch. They both traded shots and both were getting tagged regularly, Cain got cut 1:30 min in and 4 min in he was looking woobly af after eating jabs.

This is Cain in r1

This is Werdum

Not only Cain was visibly more damage, he was already struggling to breath. Werdum was relaxed. Cain might have won the round in points, due to total strikes + TDs, but it wasn't a good round for him.

After R1 Werdum shat on Cain, and there's no point in even discussing R2 and R3 because they weren't remotely close.

I don't know where or if have you even experimented trying to regain cardio even after one week of not doing shit. And no I'm not talking about little jogging running cardio shit. I've seen sprinters struggle and throw up after rolling one time trying to maintain side control on somebody. Some people can train a fuck load like real professionals and their gas tank will always be shit. Cardio is one of those things that you either have or you dont. And to the ones that have it, and like I said earlier not jogging shit but actual grappling MMA cardio like said 2 athletes, they know how valuable that shit is and probably think twice about a vacation.

Why don't use your screenshot powers to picture Werdum pedaling too. And I fail to see how Werdum "dominated" with a fucked up nose and barely being able to open one of his eyes lmao.

And I actually do something actually. I don't fight MMA as of right now but do MMA classes and got my purple belt in BJJ the last week of May

but that wont matter because you apparently are a cardio expert

 

[habajiga]

While Venom is right on the part about "Cardio is one of those things that you either have or you dont. ", you can always train and gameplan to conserve your energy and move accordingly, increasing longevity. IDK about other sports but in BJJ it is a crucial part to use your energy wisely, regardless of cardio, and same with MMA. It's much like power, some people don't have it but due to their technique land cleaner/more precise shots that have the impact of someone with power landing it.
Edit: Watch Werdum's fights in the UFC that go to the later rounds, he doesn't have the best cardio but is very wise in terms of movement and picking his shots, and in turn conserving energy which leads to longevity.

 

[DracoMaster Dab]

as big of a fan as i am of him velasquez deserved to lose for being stupid enough to train at sea level to prepare for the fight.as for the fight itself i was surprised velasquez didnt attempt more takedowns when he was being peppered by werdum's strikes i mean i know werdum is good on the ground but even alistair overeem a much worse grappler than velasquez had solid success against werdum on the ground.As for the cardio thing there are no excuses velasquez should have prepped better and since mma is all about good preparation velasquez deserved to lose plain and simple.Despite all that i still think velasquez will win a rematch if he prepares well because the last time cain lost he came back in terrifying fashion and i expect it to happen this time too.Speaking of werdum i think his next opp is prolly JDS due to the whole redemption thing. HW division is looking interesting with many new contenders coming out of the blue.Andrei arlovski has looked great,stipe miocic has looked fkn awesome,alistair overeem looks rejuvenated and improved,hell even ben rothwell can be a contender if he wins his next fight which is prolly against a top 10 hw.So,all in all the lifeless hw division has come to life and im happy af :D.

 

[Saria]

I don't know where or if have you even experimented trying to regain cardio even after one week of not doing shit. And no I'm not talking about little jogging running cardio shit. I've seen sprinters struggle and throw up after rolling one time trying to maintain side control on somebody. Some people can train a fuck load like real professionals and their gas tank will always be shit. Cardio is one of those things that you either have or you dont. And to the ones that have it, and like I said earlier not jogging shit but actual grappling MMA cardio like said 2 athletes, they know how valuable that shit is and probably think twice about a vacation.

Why don't use your screenshot powers to picture Werdum pedaling too. And I fail to see how Werdum "dominated" with a fucked up nose and barely being able to open one of his eyes lmao.

And I actually do something actually. I don't fight MMA as of right now but do MMA classes and got my purple belt in BJJ the last week of May

but that wont matter because you apparently are a cardio expert

I have practiced multiple sports in my entire live, including boxing, and I have had to deal with multiple injuries and asthma as a child, so I guess the "born with cardio" doesn't apply to me. Despite that, I'm currently focusing in long distance running, but I guess I am trans-cardio or something and the years I spent training to get over my shortcomings were unnecessary.

If you honestly know people who automatically lose their cardio if they don't train for a week, you should tell them to contact their doctors, because they have some sort of obscure, never-seen-before disorder. But obviously there wasno bullshit in that statement, same with the "athletes throwing up after a small amount of training" one.

Cardio itself is 100% proper training (having a good routine, good diet and being consistent); ask literally any professional. In sports like MMA, knowing how to use your stamina and knowing your limits is incredibly important, but improving your cardio is practically the same in every sport. There's a reason why people like Nick Diaz, who is a triathlete, never look tired inside the cage.

But let's focus on Cain. Cain is a HW known for his cardio and non-stop pace, so, if we follow your terrible baseless argument, he would be the kind of person who HAS cardio. How can you even imply the HW with the most impressive cardio in the history of the sport is someone who "doesn't have it"? Like jesus, are you sure you are trying to defend Cain? Yeah, he had to deal with injuries, but: 1) he's not the first person who had to deal with one [DC, Rockhold, Weidman, Aldo, etc] 2) He had more than enough time to rehabilitate and have a proper training camp

The problem wasn't Cain's injury, that "he doesn't have it", or whatever other bullshit you have. The problem was that he trains at sea level and only trained for one week in Mexico. No regular training is going to prepare you to perform at high altitude. Gilbert Melendez, another fighter who has been know as a cardio freak and who even got caught for roiding in that event (so he was more than trained!), also gassed in one round. Why? because he also though he didn't need to adapt his body to mexico's altitude and went to that country like 3 days before his fight. Both underestimated Mexico's altitude and both lost after having a decent start.

I don't know why is it so hard for you to accept that Cain didn't prepare himself properly and got wrecked because of that mistake. I like Cain and his grinding style, and I have disliked Werdum since his shit fight with Overreem in strikeforce, but I have no problems admitting that Werdum was by far the superior fighter in that fight, mostly thanks to his superior preparation.

The "screenshot power" is called literally rewatching the fight and taking a screenshot. You should try rewatching the fight instead of throwing baseless fake crap like "Werdum was backpedaling", that way you'll see by yourself that while Cain was struggling to breath and bleeding in his corner, Werdum was getting his sweat dried up with a towel.

Hide

and that was after round 1, the only round Cain won. It baffles me how you imply Werdum was more damaged.

But I'm sure what you say has more weight than stats and analyses posted in every single decent MMA site, screenshots of the fight, highlight videos, and a video of the fight.

I can pm you a link to a decent quality stream if that's what you want.

=====

Moving on from the pointless subject.

I'm really hyped for tomorrow / today's event. Lots of interesting fights.

As much as I like Mendes' current style, nothing would be better than seeing Conor beat him with ease, just like he has done with everyone else in the UFC. Realistically, I doubt Mendes gets finished early and the fight will be anything but easy, however I'm still rooting for Conor.

But the fight I really want to see is Lawler vs Rory. As much as I like Lawler (I've been following him since strikeforce), he did not deserve that last win over Hendricks because he looked like garbage. If he looks half as bad as he did in his last fight (Completely frozen for 2 rounds, dry humped for almost 25 minutes), Rory will dismantle him.

Hope Gunni doesn't get dominated by a stronger fighter again :(!

 

[Mattapod]

Isnip

Snip

i dont think its as black and white as you guys are making it. i think its more like this:
a given athlete has a capacity for both strength and cardio. everyones capacity is different, but how hard you train dictates where within that range you fall. some people are born with a huge gastank, but if they sit on the couch eating oreos theyre not going to have good cardio. it diminishes just like muscle tissue atrophies. some are born with a tiny one, but if they work hard it becomes acceptable.

the adage "hard work beats talent when talent doesnt work hard" is definitely true

in this case, my opinion would be that cain does have an insane gas tank, but fighting at altitude cut his tank down to about 50%.

also hikari i have to disagree, i think lawler decisevely took that belt in the second fight. hendricks offense totally shut down in round 4, and that tekken esque combo for the last 30 seconds of round 5 solidified the win

 

[VuvuzelaBzz]

also hikari i have to disagree, i think lawler decisevely took that belt in the second fight. hendricks offense totally shut down in round 4, and that tekken esque combo for the last 30 seconds of round 5 solidified the win

There was nothing decisive about that fight and neither guy deserved to win it. Lawler was MIA for the better part of 15 minutes and Hendricks mistook Lawler's crotch for his long-lost teddy bear. As far as I'm concerned, tonight's fight is for the vacant WW title.

On paper this is one of the best cards of the year. Hope McGregor pulls through and ends up fighting Aldo in Ireland, but Mendes should be a tough matchup unless Conor's TDD turns out to be elite.

 

[habajiga]

Wow.