A Forgotten Threat - Ho-oh Discussion

How does this set look (Haven't tested):

Ho-oh @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 192 HP/252 Atk/64 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Sacred Fire
- Brave Bird
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Can come into special attackers not named Kyogre. Ho-oh has nice bulk, and can switch into Darkrai and possibly get a kill if Sleep Talk doesn't pick Rest.
I don't think that a Sleeptalker Ho-oh would be so nice to play. First of all it haven't got a good staying power. Also Darkrai sometimes has Thunder and/or Ice Beam, so this could make problems to this Ho-oh.
That's my opinion about this set.
 
I don't think that a Sleeptalker Ho-oh would be so nice to play. First of all it haven't got a good staying power. Also Darkrai sometimes has Thunder and/or Ice Beam, so this could make problems to this Ho-oh.
That's my opinion about this set.
No good staying power? As long as Ho-oh is brought in without Stealth Rock hampering it, it has excellent staying power, actually. If a ResTalk set is used, though, I'd use Jibaku's spread capable of taking a +4 Dark Pulse from Darkrai.

I would generally agree though - SubRoost is generally a more efficient option.
 

shrang

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Have you tried Jibaku's spread??

EVs: 192 HP / 216 Atk / 24 Spd / 76 SDef

This allows you to survive a +4 Darkrai's Dark Pulse at full health, which is pretty sexy. I don't know how well it'll do in doubles, but whatever.
 

shrang

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I saw trickroom use it in one of our battles some time ago (He Punishmented my Bulk Up Palkia to death, but he was only at what, 30%??). Scarf Ho-oh is nice, but there are better revenge killers out there in my opinion. Ho-oh is just too slow, IMO. She can't revenge any common variant of Ray at all (Mixquaza isn't really a sweeper), as she loses to DD and SD (She might be able to survive a +2 LO Extremespeed, only if you pack quite a bit of Def EVs). The Pokes she can reliably revenge are Lati@s, Mewtwo, Darkrai and Skymin, without Scarves. If you look at these Pokes, you can easily see that other revenge killers can do the same thing, while checking things like Rayquaza. Scarf Dialga is an excellent example. He can Draco Meteor pretty much all of them to death, and can use Outrage on Lati@s to bypass their Soul Dew boosted Special Defense, while at the same time, checking SD Ray and non-boosted DD Ray. Dialga also resists SR, while Ho-oh takes 50% from it. Ho-oh can be a good revenge killer, but most of the time, she's outclassed in that role. She's better off using that annoying SubRoost Physical Attacker set.

On the topic of the Physical Attacking SubRoost set, does anyone think she's one of the best tempo controlling Pokemon out there?? If your opponent is spamming Darkrai and Mewtwo and setting up, you can put Ho-oh in there to either threaten it out or kill it, bringing the momentum back in your favour. You can pretty much go "Alright, too fast here, Ho-oh, slow the match down" and she will. On the other side of the spectrum, she can rape a stall team by herself, allowing you to go "Alright, fuck this stall fest, I want this game quickened up".
 
Its to bad that there most physical fire moves suck, Ho-oh, could make great use of a better one, mabye in gen5? :D
 

shrang

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Ho-oh has a great physical fire move, it's called Sacred Fire, EDIT: Probably one of the most broken moves in the game
 
Its to bad that there most physical fire moves suck, Ho-oh, could make great use of a better one, mabye in gen5? :D
He does have one; a Fire physical STAB that rapes Physical attackers. It's probably the most broken move ever with its 50% burn rate, automatically thaws Freeze status, and has 95 accuracy.
 
I actually use a CB Ho-Oh on my team.
It is sunny day, so it gets alot of health:

CB + Sunny Day + STAB + 100 BP = BIG DAMAGE!

I also use it on VGC, and he is very succesful, what is better than a Ho-Oh....
 
He does have one; a Fire physical STAB that rapes Physical attackers. It's probably the most broken move ever with its 50% burn rate, automatically thaws Freeze status, and has 95 accuracy.
The one bad thing is with presure in ubers the PP runs out to fast
 
anyone tried scarf ho-oh?
Scarf ho-oh is not totally outclassed by scarf dragons.Sun boosted sacred fires 2hkoes wobbuffet,some groudons,dialga and darkrai.2hkoing bulky dialga is something scarf palkia and dialga cannot do.Ho-oh holding scarf revenge kills latias and latios regardless of boosts and ho-oh can somewhat punished +6 kyogres for major damage.After 2 calm minds,scarf palkia and dialga is not 2hkoing kyogre while ho-oh can come close to ohkoing kyogre with a max power punishment.Brave bird 2hkoes most kyogres and giratina-O after taking stealth rock.
 
Before HGSS, I used Scarf Ho-oh with Sacred Fire / Punishment / Thunder / HP Ice on my stall team, and I had about the same level of success as I did when I used Scarf Dialga. But now, I can't see why I wouldn't use a bulky Ho-oh. In fact, I really need to try a Light Screen / Roost / Toxic / Sacred Fire user, which sounds like it could be cool.
 
I've had massive success with hooh using it together with shedinja. Both are excellent pokemon kn ubers that are killed by sr, so just pack in a forry. Rest of my team is dialga, heatran and groudon. Forry is o useful since sheddy and my team cause tons of switches, and groudon boosts hooh and trans power. The staple on the team is hooh though, since practically nothing can take it's attacks and survive, while it can just roosr off damage. Easily can be compared to kyogre and arceus as an uber among ubers...
 

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